AUP Update - January 19, 2012

[lostcat461]

Dude (I am now imagining you have a surfer accent), I said a simple search. That doesn't imply I think I saw every car picture. Just like when you throw a net you don't expect to catch every single fish. :P

What it shows is that yes people are submitting them. But probably not in a huge degree, as they usually mention car in the title or the posting somewhere.

Here is the thing. You were caught, and you feel victimized. Think of car posting as speeding tickets. Lots of people speed, but has everyone had a ticket? No. You drew the attention somehow and got smacked down. And they will enforce it, otherwise all of it is pointless.

[Rukh_Whitefang]

Dude (I am now imagining you have a surfer accent), I said a simple search. That doesn't imply I think I saw every car picture. Just like when you throw a net you don't expect to catch every single fish. :P

What it shows is that yes people are submitting them. But probably not in a huge degree, as they usually mention car in the title or the posting somewhere.

Here is the thing. You were caught, and you feel victimized. Think of car posting as speeding tickets. Lots of people speed, but has everyone had a ticket? No. You drew the attention somehow and got smacked down. And they will enforce it, otherwise all of it is pointless.

First off no. There is a Jeep, JDM, Nissan, Chevy, Ford, Rockibilly, and a gearhead group (Thats just all off the top of my head). All of which have car photos up. That doesn't include the dozens of members of each group that upload photos on a regular basis.

Secondly I was not Caught. We were explicitly told by former mods and admins that we were allowed to upload photos, as I said in my previous post. So, nice try with the "your just all butthurt" comment. Not to mention this isn't the first flip flop to happen. If my memory serves me with is the 3rd time the site has flipped flopped on this issue.

I am irritated at the flip flopping of the site on this issue. Ask any of the car enthusiasts and they will tell you the same thing I am. The site, needs to make up its mind and then enforce the rules fairly. Either allow photos of cars in a car show style setting, or don't at all. Allowing groups to upload material that the site says isn't allowed but targeting a single user for having car photos is crap.

Car group leaders have sent messages to the admins to get a full explanation of the flip flop but no response at all has been given.

I have been in contact with the main car group on FA, and i have been told that they ere informed last time this all went down that we had permission from Dragoneer that we could upload car photos. For those that doubt me here is the copied message.

I first sent a shout to them which was:

Yet again the site changed its AUP disallowing car photos. Just got a "friendly" message from a site admin. I am sick and tired of this flip flopping.

The following was the group leaders response:

Would you mind sending me the message you got? I have yet to receive anything from an admin about changes. But if people are starting to get messages like that I will need to talk directly with dragoneer as I have before, he may not know how the people he puts in charge are interpreting the rules.


So clearly, Like I have said from the beginning this is not a "I got caught now I am butthurt" type deal. I will honor the sites rules no matter hpw stupid I think some of them are. Thats not the issue here. The issue here is we were given permission to upload these pictures. Now months later, I get a friendly message from the site admins rescinding there previous statement to us car guys (and gals) going back on their word. Not to mention then there is the lack of communication between the admins and the car groups and even between the admins themselves. The site cannot have admins going around and telling people things that actually break site rules.

[Fay V]

First off no. There is a Peep, JDM, Nissan, Chevy, Ford, Rockibilly, and a gearhead group (Thats just all off the top of my head). All of which have car photos up. That doesn't include the dozens of members of each group that upload photos on a regular basis.

Secondly I was not Caught. We were told by former mods and admins that we were allowed to upload photos, as I said in my previous post. So, nice try with the "your just all butthurt" comment. Not to mention this isn't the first flip flop to happen. If my memory serves me with is the 3rd time the site has flipped flopped on this issue.

I am irritated at the flip flopping of the site on this issue. Ask any of the car enthusiasts and they will tell you the same thing I am. The site, needs to make up its mind and then enforce the rules fairly. Either allow photos of cars in a car show style setting, or don't at all. Allowing groups to upload material that the site says isn't allowed but targeting a single user for having car photos is crap.

The fact of the matter is that the policy didn't flip flop. We had admins giving out the WRONG information. We're drafting something to make it more clear and explain to the issue to any car enthusiasts. It sucks but it's the end result of poor communication and admins acting before knowing what the AUP was.
Right now the rules pretty much fall in line with manufactured items. You can' just display a picture with the intent to showcase a car. You can submit a car photo meant to showcase the artistic qualities of the photographers methods and style. You can submit images in which you have personally modified the vehicle in a significant and artistic way.
If it isn't modified and it is not meant for artistic expression don't post it. If you see it, report it.

[lostcat461]

Ya know, I never said or meant "Your just all butthurt." No I simply assumed that there was some reason that you, and I'll quote correctly " Can't even get a clear statement from the admins. And then when we are told that they are looking into it, 2 weeks go by with no response. All the while I am forbidden to put up car photos, while everyone else is still uploading new photos everyday."

So since broad generalization fails me, why are you forbidden and no one else? (Since you weren't caught doing it and threatened with said gallery wipe and thus having a painful butt) Cause otherwise, you'd have just as much unauthorized ability to spam car picks as anyone else.

[Rukh_Whitefang]

The fact of the matter is that the policy didn't flip flop. We had admins giving out the WRONG information. We're drafting something to make it more clear and explain to the issue to any car enthusiasts. It sucks but it's the end result of poor communication and admins acting before knowing what the AUP was.
Right now the rules pretty much fall in line with manufactured items. You can' just display a picture with the intent to showcase a car. You can submit a car photo meant to showcase the artistic qualities of the photographers methods and style. You can submit images in which you have personally modified the vehicle in a significant and artistic way.
If it isn't modified and it is not meant for artistic expression don't post it. If you see it, report it.

We got out permission from Dragoneer. This is my point...

Nearly every photo I personally had up was a moddifed car. Not one was stock. Some had sectioned side panels and roof lines. My own personal car has body mods to it. Not to mention underhood mods.

Not to mention one of my photos I left the cmera lense open for longer to make traffic look like it was rushing past a 2nd gen Camaro. That was banned as well. So please, don't tell me otherwise. I had plenty of photos that were showcasing photography and the car was just the image. And those were not allowed either.

Secondly you will have to take it up with all the group leaders that say the site rules did change to allow us to appreciate our art.

Thirdly the policy did change, for us personally. We were given permission to upload are photos as what we do for a hobby with cars, is an art and we were told it was an exception.

[GingerM]

We got out permission from Dragoneer. This is my point...

It would probably help those admins if you could quote the PM or whatever it was you got from Dragoneer. Unfortunately, simply asserting that you did receive this permission will be met with disbelief by some.

[Dragoneer]

We got out permission from Dragoneer. This is my point...

I'm working on a few things right, and one of them is trying to resolve the issues behind this. Obviously, things need to be worded better to both protect those who take legitimate pictures of cars but prevent those who are trying to spam them.

[Kindragon]

is there going to be any admin activity on the issues with Second Life "screenshots"? It's now been a month and as far as I'm concerned Second Life stuff is still banned from the site due to being screenshots by the admins.

[Xenke]

is there going to be any admin activity on the issues with Second Life "screenshots"? It's now been a month and as far as I'm concerned Second Life stuff is still banned from the site due to being screenshots by the admins.

Reread the 3D Modeling portion of the AUP, specifically the "Presentation" section.

[Verin Asper]

is there going to be any admin activity on the issues with Second Life "screenshots"? It's now been a month and as far as I'm concerned Second Life stuff is still banned from the site due to being screenshots by the admins.

Someone very late on that the aup have since last year allowed Showcasing/presentation of SL avatars.
Random screenshots are still not allowed

[Kindragon]

Someone very late on that the aup have since last year allowed Showcasing/presentation of SL avatars.
Random screenshots are still not allowed

Not according to a couple of the admins. They claimed that a screenshot is still a screenshot and that the rules specific to Second Life and/or 3D models do not override the screenshot rule. Thus why I'm asking for follow up from the administration.

[Kindragon]

Reread the 3D Modeling portion of the AUP, specifically the "Presentation" section.

The admins who removed the works stated that the 3D modeling portion of the AUP does not override the screenshot rule, and since anything from SecondLife is a "screenshot" that effectively bans anything made in Second Life from being submitted. This is why I've been asking for clarification from the FA administrators above the two who removed my works.

[Verin Asper]

Not according to a couple of the admins. They claimed that a screenshot is still a screenshot and that the rules specific to Second Life and/or 3D models do not override the screenshot rule. Thus why I'm asking for follow up from the administration.

...
Again random screenshots are not allowed (as in that you may not post any screenshots of said avatar on SL)
you can still Showcase what you did to your avatar by simply taking said avatar and placing it on a custom/blank background to keep the focus on it(exp: 1(NSFW) 2 3)
Something like this wont pass

[CaptainCool]

ok i got a question. maybe it was answered before, i dunno.
"Photographic work must be suitable for all ages, and submissions MAY NOT be rated higher than General."
then why can i set a photo to mature or adult when i upload it? couldnt the site be set so that if a submission features photo information (camera name, aperture and all that like in my photo here: https://www.furaffinity.net/view/7279434) or is set to be uploaded into the photo category that the submission page rejects the image and notifies the user about that specific rule?
ive seen lots of mature and adult rated photos during the last couple of days and this would stop them from being uploaded at all. someone wouldnt upload a photo of himself in a "sexy and suggestive pose" if he couldnt set the image higher than general :P

[Kindragon]

...
Again random screenshots are not allowed (as in that you may not post any screenshots of said avatar on SL)
you can still Showcase what you did to your avatar by simply taking said avatar and placing it on a custom/blank background to keep the focus on it(exp: 1(NSFW) 2 3)
Something like this wont pass

Alright... This doesn't explain the issue I experienced with the admins removing my works saying SecondLife works are screenshots and thus are not permitted.

[Verin Asper]

Alright... This doesn't explain the issue I experienced with the admins removing my works saying SecondLife works are screenshots and thus are not permitted.

Said the person who STILL as of yet havent shown WHAT the admins removed to provide more information. Heres the thing I'm assuming already that your work was what didnt pass in my example to which is why they removed it, not of the examples that DO pass.

[Kindragon]

Said the person who STILL as of yet havent shown WHAT the admins removed to provide more information. Heres the thing I'm assuming already that your work was what didnt pass in my example to which is why they removed it, not of the examples that DO pass.

You mean this? https://inkbunny.net/submissionview.php?id=193693

Or maybe this? https://inkbunny.net/submissionview.php?id=193688

Or maybe even this? https://inkbunny.net/submissionview.php?id=198175

These are all not permitted, yet screenshots like http://www.furaffinity.net/view/5805673/, http://www.furaffinity.net/view/794750/, and http://www.furaffinity.net/view/699063/ are somehow okay.

[Garuru_Wolf]

So uh...after being linked to a journal that I really wish I could unsee, it got me wondering about the rules involving what is acceptable to upload in a journal. I looked at the AUP but didn't see any mention about rules for journals (maybe I'm just blind). But really, what are the rules about a journal advertising and linking to a rather...exotic and NSFW (not talking art here..) webcam session? :X

[Verin Asper]

You mean this? https://inkbunny.net/submissionview.php?id=193693

Or maybe this? https://inkbunny.net/submissionview.php?id=193688

Or maybe even this? https://inkbunny.net/submissionview.php?id=198175

These are all not permitted, yet screenshots like http://www.furaffinity.net/view/5805673/, http://www.furaffinity.net/view/794750/, and http://www.furaffinity.net/view/699063/ are somehow okay.

Obsidian thats you, Deskai/Folseh here
anyway its odd your stuff should of been allowed since those are actually CUSTOM work, to those that you have shown the first two just BARELY make it pass, the last one no

if anything do the right thing and report instead of complain, and I think I know which admin told you that its a screenshot. So far that admin have shown to be a complete moron if not probably doesnt even know the SecondLife is now part of BOTH screenshot rules and 3d works rules.

So uh...after being linked to a journal that I really wish I could unsee, it got me wondering about the rules involving what is acceptable to upload in a journal. I looked at the AUP but didn't see any mention about rules for journals (maybe I'm just blind). But really, what are the rules about a journal advertising and linking to a rather...exotic and NSFW (not talking art here..) webcam session? :X

The person have to state that the session is NSFW, if they have done so they are somewhat not at fault as they did openly state that subject inside the journal is NSFW (that includes links)

[Kindragon]

if anything do the right thing and report instead of complain

Report to whom? I was told to bring the issue to this forum if I disagreed with the admin's decision regarding my works. Hence why I brought up questions for clarification on the rules regarding Second Life works.

[Verin Asper]

Report to whom? I was told to bring the issue to this forum if I disagreed with the admin's decision regarding my works. Hence why I brought up questions for clarification on the rules regarding Second Life works.

go find warmock, they were the one I worked with to change the AUP around Secondlife, if anything they know the most about this and if they say your work is fine really no other admin can(actually mainly that one idiot admin) cant touch you cause your work was proven to be within the AUP

[Garuru_Wolf]

The person have to state that the session is NSFW, if they have done so they are somewhat not at fault as they did openly state that subject inside the journal is NSFW (that includes links)

Is this an official staff statement on the issue then? Where can I find this in the rules? (Sorry, I can't tell if you're a staff member giving an official ruling or a member giving an opinion. I would like to have an official ruling so I know whether to report such things in the future or not)

[MARVOL]

I had a question, Are Tattoos banned from FA? and are tattoos not considered art? because I had one of my tattoo removed from my gallery. this is my tattoo http://www.furaffinity.net/view/6779709/ .they are good tattoos, they are artistic and, furry. the mod said it was removed because I wasn't wearing a shirt. can someone give me a good answer.

[CaptainCool]

I had a question, Are Tattoos banned from FA? and are tattoos not considered art? because I had one of my tattoo removed from my gallery. this is my tattoo http://www.furaffinity.net/view/6779709/ .they are good tattoos, they are artistic and, furry. the mod said it was removed because I wasn't wearing a shirt. can someone give me a good answer.

did you upload more than one photo of it? because that isnt allowed here and falls under the photo dump/similar content part of the AUP. shirtless is alright in my opinion as long as you are still covering your shame properly^^
you already have a photo of the tattoo in your gallery. isnt that enough? :P if you want more than one photo of in your gallery you should make a collage or post links to more photos in the description of the submission.

[CerbrusNL]

Let's take a look at the related AUP section:

Clothing - All models featured in photography must be appropriately dressed, wearing both top and bottom garments. Underwear, bras or diapers are not considered acceptable articles of clothing. Clothing designed for explicit or implicit sexual themes are prohibited. Costumes, props, masks, jewellery and other worn items are permitted provided they meet the site's General rating (are work safe, rated for all users/ages).

Since that's not the case in the submission, it's removed.