CannonFodder
Resistance is futile! If 0 ohm
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
Huzzah! The Danth's law has been doubled.
Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting July!
- Thread starter Mircea
- Start date
Term_the_Schmuck
Most Interesting Man on FAF
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
^ Term's Law.
^ Term's Law.
CannonFodder
Resistance is futile! If 0 ohm
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
You do realize by doing that means having a debate with you is pointless, because no matter what you can claim victory regardless of what you post and therefore the debate is in reality a one sided argument.
Aden
Play from your ****ing HEART
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
It's not hard to define 'corporation' as a legal entity without it carrying all the other aspects of legally being a 'person'. Do we allow corporations to cast votes in the ballot box as well? If someone drives a corporation into the ground, has he committed murder?
It's not them being legal entities that's the problem; it's the 'corporations are people' terminology—and the dangerous potential for extrapolation that comes with it—that I can't stand.
It's not hard to define 'corporation' as a legal entity without it carrying all the other aspects of legally being a 'person'. Do we allow corporations to cast votes in the ballot box as well? If someone drives a corporation into the ground, has he committed murder?
It's not them being legal entities that's the problem; it's the 'corporations are people' terminology—and the dangerous potential for extrapolation that comes with it—that I can't stand.
Last edited:
AshleyAshes
Arcade Snowmew Of Doom
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
Oh no, only legal natural persons can vote. ^_^
There's two legal subtypes of persons, legal natural persons are the fleshy kind that can vote.
Oh no, only legal natural persons can vote. ^_^
There's two legal subtypes of persons, legal natural persons are the fleshy kind that can vote.
Corto
Member
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
Hey you Americans have that too?
Yeah, corps are "persons". We call them "persona juridica", basically "legal person", as opposed to "natural persons" (actual people). They do not share all traits.
EDIT: And there's no dangerous spiral or slope or any other kind of moral debate about it. It's just a term. One that, for a lawyer, means something radically different than for most people.
Hey you Americans have that too?
Yeah, corps are "persons". We call them "persona juridica", basically "legal person", as opposed to "natural persons" (actual people). They do not share all traits.
EDIT: And there's no dangerous spiral or slope or any other kind of moral debate about it. It's just a term. One that, for a lawyer, means something radically different than for most people.
Last edited:
Term_the_Schmuck
Most Interesting Man on FAF
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
Pretty much the same thing you're doing by claiming arbitrary laws derived from RPGs in order to feign some sort of cleverness or snarkiness to somehow place yourself above the people you're debating.
Term's Law.
Trust me CF, as I mentioned before it's useless to continue the conversation because you're hung up on treating entities as something which MUST be flesh and blood, which is not how the legal system works or has ever worked as so long as there have been all those types of businesses I've mentioned. Its some arbitrary hang up you apparently have to try and justify why those corporations claims should be diminished all because "think of the little guy" which apparently no one bothered to think about when they started pirating to begin with which brings us full circle. I don't believe you have any concept of the legal ramifications of owning a business or of liability. If you did you wouldn't be trying to use biology to argue legal theory.
Pretty much the same thing you're doing by claiming arbitrary laws derived from RPGs in order to feign some sort of cleverness or snarkiness to somehow place yourself above the people you're debating.
Term's Law.
Trust me CF, as I mentioned before it's useless to continue the conversation because you're hung up on treating entities as something which MUST be flesh and blood, which is not how the legal system works or has ever worked as so long as there have been all those types of businesses I've mentioned. Its some arbitrary hang up you apparently have to try and justify why those corporations claims should be diminished all because "think of the little guy" which apparently no one bothered to think about when they started pirating to begin with which brings us full circle. I don't believe you have any concept of the legal ramifications of owning a business or of liability. If you did you wouldn't be trying to use biology to argue legal theory.
CannonFodder
Resistance is futile! If 0 ohm
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
Do you really still not understand I'm not going "think of the little people", but rather I'm going "companies aren't people in a literal sense"?
Last edited:
Commiecomrade
Maximum Awesome.
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
These people are going to have to look through pages upon pages of furfag porn before they find MY illegal activities. :V
But seriously... Can't we use Tor or something? How about taking a laptop to a Wifi hotspot?
These people are going to have to look through pages upon pages of furfag porn before they find MY illegal activities. :V
But seriously... Can't we use Tor or something? How about taking a laptop to a Wifi hotspot?
E
Elim Garak
Guest
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
I would like to say this, I will pirate a game with massive amounts of dlc coming out, I will pirate music published by a major corporation knowing that no money from that sale will go to the artist themselves with keeping in mind that most of the artist money comes from public performances. I make exceptions for artists where I can buy from them almost directly with bandcamp(for an example I paid 10 dollars for symphony of Science albums even though you don't have to). I also buy indie or other games straight from the dev. I have each humble bundle with at least 10 dollars given to them.
I would like to say this, I will pirate a game with massive amounts of dlc coming out, I will pirate music published by a major corporation knowing that no money from that sale will go to the artist themselves with keeping in mind that most of the artist money comes from public performances. I make exceptions for artists where I can buy from them almost directly with bandcamp(for an example I paid 10 dollars for symphony of Science albums even though you don't have to). I also buy indie or other games straight from the dev. I have each humble bundle with at least 10 dollars given to them.
Term_the_Schmuck
Most Interesting Man on FAF
Term's merged post
If that's not your motive then why bring it up? Because "companies aren't flesh and blood people" means about as much to the conversation as saying "you know Iceland isn't really all covered in ice."
What's your justification? Why is that developer who happens to put out DLC for their game suddenly not worthy of your dollar but you apparently still deserve to play their product? Suddenly the men and women of Bethesda don't deserve to be compensated for their hard work on a game because they they put out expansion packs for Fallout?
Seems pretty arbitrary to me that "because DLC" is the only excuse someone has to pirate the fruit of someone else's hard-work, education, and man hours.
If that's not your motive then why bring it up? Because "companies aren't flesh and blood people" means about as much to the conversation as saying "you know Iceland isn't really all covered in ice."
What's your justification? Why is that developer who happens to put out DLC for their game suddenly not worthy of your dollar but you apparently still deserve to play their product? Suddenly the men and women of Bethesda don't deserve to be compensated for their hard work on a game because they they put out expansion packs for Fallout?
Seems pretty arbitrary to me that "because DLC" is the only excuse someone has to pirate the fruit of someone else's hard-work, education, and man hours.
Last edited:
Mircea
Active Member
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
I have some good news everyone. It seems the project was delayed until past this July. There's no specific date as to when they wish to implement it, although evil corporations and ISP's are still hoping this year.
http://torrentfreak.com/us-six-strikes-anti-piracy-scheme-delayed-120518/
That likely means they are scared, and have taken notice people are revolted. This is our chance to react and give them a good scare. What I hope will happen is people establishing a date when they can go to their ISP and protest... maybe knock at their door and have a nice heated discussion (I don't wish to imagine a worse scenario yet).
If such happens the project will certainly be killed, and we would further send a message to those who wish to crush the internet so they understand once and for all we'll never accept it in any form. Including those who support CISPA, who they hopefully understand will also not pass for the sake of both sides and everyone else.
Also, corporations are indeed not people. The reason oppressive laws get pushed so much in the US is that rich corporations donate huge amounts of money so the world is shaped their way. There's a debate specifically on separating beings with rights from corporations (an amendment to the constitution) which I fully support. Unless we separate the two and stop passing laws over firms paying money to politicians, we WILL end up a dictatorship.
I have some good news everyone. It seems the project was delayed until past this July. There's no specific date as to when they wish to implement it, although evil corporations and ISP's are still hoping this year.
http://torrentfreak.com/us-six-strikes-anti-piracy-scheme-delayed-120518/
That likely means they are scared, and have taken notice people are revolted. This is our chance to react and give them a good scare. What I hope will happen is people establishing a date when they can go to their ISP and protest... maybe knock at their door and have a nice heated discussion (I don't wish to imagine a worse scenario yet).
If such happens the project will certainly be killed, and we would further send a message to those who wish to crush the internet so they understand once and for all we'll never accept it in any form. Including those who support CISPA, who they hopefully understand will also not pass for the sake of both sides and everyone else.
Also, corporations are indeed not people. The reason oppressive laws get pushed so much in the US is that rich corporations donate huge amounts of money so the world is shaped their way. There's a debate specifically on separating beings with rights from corporations (an amendment to the constitution) which I fully support. Unless we separate the two and stop passing laws over firms paying money to politicians, we WILL end up a dictatorship.
Randy-Darkshade
Bike riding squirrel thing.
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
I don;t think this law is necessary. I mean I can find out my own search history without trying so just think how easy it is for law enforcement to find out what you've searched for and eventually find out what you've been DLing.
Because too Elim, ruining someone's hardwork is perfectly fine.
I don;t think this law is necessary. I mean I can find out my own search history without trying so just think how easy it is for law enforcement to find out what you've searched for and eventually find out what you've been DLing.
Because too Elim, ruining someone's hardwork is perfectly fine.
Last edited:
Term_the_Schmuck
Most Interesting Man on FAF
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
Wut? How the hell did you come to that conclusion that they're "scared?" Because I just read that article and they hinted at the fact that ISPs are still trying to flesh out the logistics of the warning system. No where in that article does it say anything about companies being "scared" or that some sort of victory has been achieved. Are you that desperate to believe the righteousness of your side that you're going to take any news of a reasonable delay as some sort of direct result of the voice of the people? C'mon now. And yes I'm sure they'll be really scared when you show up to their offices and get tossed out by security while rambling on about revolution should this measure be implemented.
Why would it be killed? Because really this is a much more optimal situation for the companies involved because it takes the federal government out of the equation and they are able to enforce themselves, which is part of the reason why things like the MPAA, ESRB, and others were created. ISPs forming their own program to help enforce copyright would not be contingent on votes or the worry of election to office.
How does a company giving money to a campaign suddenly lead to an immediate dictatorship? Suddenly the checks and balances between the three branches of government no longer exist because Coke gave a million dollars to Obama's campaign? Come off it man.
And corporations still maintain their rights as the holders of intellectual property. They don't have to be flesh and blood people in order to protect their registered trademarks, IPs, and so on. And they absolutely maintain their rights to seek reasonable compensation when they are wronged by someone violating their copyright.
Wut? How the hell did you come to that conclusion that they're "scared?" Because I just read that article and they hinted at the fact that ISPs are still trying to flesh out the logistics of the warning system. No where in that article does it say anything about companies being "scared" or that some sort of victory has been achieved. Are you that desperate to believe the righteousness of your side that you're going to take any news of a reasonable delay as some sort of direct result of the voice of the people? C'mon now. And yes I'm sure they'll be really scared when you show up to their offices and get tossed out by security while rambling on about revolution should this measure be implemented.
Why would it be killed? Because really this is a much more optimal situation for the companies involved because it takes the federal government out of the equation and they are able to enforce themselves, which is part of the reason why things like the MPAA, ESRB, and others were created. ISPs forming their own program to help enforce copyright would not be contingent on votes or the worry of election to office.
How does a company giving money to a campaign suddenly lead to an immediate dictatorship? Suddenly the checks and balances between the three branches of government no longer exist because Coke gave a million dollars to Obama's campaign? Come off it man.
And corporations still maintain their rights as the holders of intellectual property. They don't have to be flesh and blood people in order to protect their registered trademarks, IPs, and so on. And they absolutely maintain their rights to seek reasonable compensation when they are wronged by someone violating their copyright.
Randy-Darkshade
Bike riding squirrel thing.
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
I'd just like to point out that corporations are ran by people. People who designed the stuff the corporations are trying to protect.
I'd just like to point out that corporations are ran by people. People who designed the stuff the corporations are trying to protect.
Mircea
Active Member
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
Term_the_Schmuck: Yes, we know you are among those who support crushing the internet for companies to be rich and happy... thank you. Hopefully you will have the same done to you someday, and we'll see if you like it when all your rights are taken away while others do what they want with your stuff. Also, I'm normally against generalizing... but it's sad to see that people who work in the entertainment industry are all the same. As long as something benefits you, even if it harms millions of other people, it's a good thing and must be defended. Yeah, you're all the same.
As for companies, the issue I seen discussed in a past article is that companies can give huge amounts of money to elections in order for laws to be passed. It was the founding principle of SOPA; Hollywood and other b-tards wanted it, so they paid millions if not billions to the government, senators, and what not so it would be passed. Otherwise a law like that would have probably not even been allowed into debate. The amendment I read addressed mainly that, and how both firms and rich individuals can give money for laws to be passed, which I don't think I need to even mention how wrong it is.
Term_the_Schmuck: Yes, we know you are among those who support crushing the internet for companies to be rich and happy... thank you. Hopefully you will have the same done to you someday, and we'll see if you like it when all your rights are taken away while others do what they want with your stuff. Also, I'm normally against generalizing... but it's sad to see that people who work in the entertainment industry are all the same. As long as something benefits you, even if it harms millions of other people, it's a good thing and must be defended. Yeah, you're all the same.
As for companies, the issue I seen discussed in a past article is that companies can give huge amounts of money to elections in order for laws to be passed. It was the founding principle of SOPA; Hollywood and other b-tards wanted it, so they paid millions if not billions to the government, senators, and what not so it would be passed. Otherwise a law like that would have probably not even been allowed into debate. The amendment I read addressed mainly that, and how both firms and rich individuals can give money for laws to be passed, which I don't think I need to even mention how wrong it is.
Randy-Darkshade
Bike riding squirrel thing.
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
Rights? Since when is it a right to break the law by violating copyright? Since when is a right to distribute someones work illegally and without their consent? I mean seriously? you're saying all these are fucking rights we have? People in the entertainment business WORK for their money. Movies are not made in a fucking day ya know, they can take months, or even years to make. Do you not realize how much fucking work goes into producing the fucking media we enjoy today? You're seriously saying these people don't deserve the money they EARNED honestly?
This isn't about supporting crushing the internet so corporations can remain rich, it's about protecting one's property. If people hadn't made pirating such a big fucking issue to start with corporations would not be trying to change the laws today. The only people to blame are those that decided to make a habit out of pirating stuff that is not theirs. If it was not for these piraters making pirating so common on the internet Hollywood, Universal and Viacom and many other businesses would not be creating SOPA/PIPA today. You only have yourselves/piraters to blame.
everyone knows politics are full of corruption, this isn't anything knew nor does it surprise me.I love how you call big movie companies bastards for wanting to protect THEIR property. I'm not saying handing money to politicians under the table is the right way to go about getting the laws changed but still, I'd be wanting to protect my property too if I was a song writer, musician or movie producer...or even animator.
I think some people are jealous because these people who run such companies are rich and they ain't.
Rights? Since when is it a right to break the law by violating copyright? Since when is a right to distribute someones work illegally and without their consent? I mean seriously? you're saying all these are fucking rights we have? People in the entertainment business WORK for their money. Movies are not made in a fucking day ya know, they can take months, or even years to make. Do you not realize how much fucking work goes into producing the fucking media we enjoy today? You're seriously saying these people don't deserve the money they EARNED honestly?
This isn't about supporting crushing the internet so corporations can remain rich, it's about protecting one's property. If people hadn't made pirating such a big fucking issue to start with corporations would not be trying to change the laws today. The only people to blame are those that decided to make a habit out of pirating stuff that is not theirs. If it was not for these piraters making pirating so common on the internet Hollywood, Universal and Viacom and many other businesses would not be creating SOPA/PIPA today. You only have yourselves/piraters to blame.
everyone knows politics are full of corruption, this isn't anything knew nor does it surprise me.I love how you call big movie companies bastards for wanting to protect THEIR property. I'm not saying handing money to politicians under the table is the right way to go about getting the laws changed but still, I'd be wanting to protect my property too if I was a song writer, musician or movie producer...or even animator.
I think some people are jealous because these people who run such companies are rich and they ain't.
Last edited:
Mircea
Active Member
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
This is not a head-on pro-piracy thing! My concern is that it will affect normal users too... both those who don't do anything illegal and those who "sin" by simply downloading a song or movie and seeding it in the process, and IMO don't deserve such shit for it either. Since someone asked a similar question on another forum, it's best I quote my reply from there:
As for the corporation thing... again, it's about being able to use money to get laws passed. Any law needs to be passed when / if the citizens of that country want it / approve of it ONLY. When laws can be passed in any way because of money, those laws are no longer there to do the right thing or protect the citizen. They are there because someone bought them. This makes the difference between a normal and free country, and a business country where freedom can be bought like potatoes from the bazaar.
This is not a head-on pro-piracy thing! My concern is that it will affect normal users too... both those who don't do anything illegal and those who "sin" by simply downloading a song or movie and seeding it in the process, and IMO don't deserve such shit for it either. Since someone asked a similar question on another forum, it's best I quote my reply from there:
As for the corporation thing... again, it's about being able to use money to get laws passed. Any law needs to be passed when / if the citizens of that country want it / approve of it ONLY. When laws can be passed in any way because of money, those laws are no longer there to do the right thing or protect the citizen. They are there because someone bought them. This makes the difference between a normal and free country, and a business country where freedom can be bought like potatoes from the bazaar.
Term_the_Schmuck
Most Interesting Man on FAF
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
Yes because I work for a living clearly I'm a terrible person. :V
Youre hoping all my rights are taken away? Oh you mean like what youre sayin about how a company deserves to have no rights and who gives a fuck how many men and women you hurt so long as you're able to get the content they worked on for free. Oh but it's okay, because "I'm an open source developer living in my mom's basement and I know all about rights". All you basement dwellers sound alike to me. :V
Now how about you actually respond to my points against your unfounded claims of dictatorships and the apparent fright companies have of people like you?
First don't use the term "b-tard" unless you're going spell it right in referring to te denizens of 4chan.
Secondly, SOPA was brought up by a politician from Texas far removed from big Hollywood influence. His district sees no immediate benefit from Hollywood and unless there's money being exchanged under the table which you can't prove, the only thing anyone can say for certain is that the MPAA and others are merely supporters of the Bill who likely did lobby for the legislation just as there exists lobbies who fought against it. Now this is becoming an issue about lobbying and special interests which is entirely different from the matter of private companies policing themselves and the services they provide.
Because as far as I've read, this policy has absolutely nothin to do with the government aside from the filing of copyright suits which deal with judges, not politicians.
Yes because I work for a living clearly I'm a terrible person. :V
Youre hoping all my rights are taken away? Oh you mean like what youre sayin about how a company deserves to have no rights and who gives a fuck how many men and women you hurt so long as you're able to get the content they worked on for free. Oh but it's okay, because "I'm an open source developer living in my mom's basement and I know all about rights". All you basement dwellers sound alike to me. :V
Now how about you actually respond to my points against your unfounded claims of dictatorships and the apparent fright companies have of people like you?
First don't use the term "b-tard" unless you're going spell it right in referring to te denizens of 4chan.
Secondly, SOPA was brought up by a politician from Texas far removed from big Hollywood influence. His district sees no immediate benefit from Hollywood and unless there's money being exchanged under the table which you can't prove, the only thing anyone can say for certain is that the MPAA and others are merely supporters of the Bill who likely did lobby for the legislation just as there exists lobbies who fought against it. Now this is becoming an issue about lobbying and special interests which is entirely different from the matter of private companies policing themselves and the services they provide.
Because as far as I've read, this policy has absolutely nothin to do with the government aside from the filing of copyright suits which deal with judges, not politicians.
Mircea
Active Member
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
And that's exactly what I'm talking about. You and those companies are doing to the whole internet what you believe the internet is doing to you. Everything you said here is what I legitly said about media companies already. Again, this is proof that media companies declared a war with internet users in my view.
You are hoping my rights are taken away, by supporting attacks on the internet that could also affect non-pirates (or small downloads that everyone did in their life). That includes both this and SOPA / PIPA / ACTA. Also that new law which makes it illegal to sell a computer or mp3 player / iPod. Or another law against jailbreaking... which is making it illegal to install a custom operating system on a Playstation or Xbox in your own home and for your own use because Sony was pissed that day. Even to post about it on the internet and explain how it could be done (free speech anyone?). So... who's rights are taken away now?
And companies believe we users have no rights when they try to get websites to be censored and users to be taken down. How many men and women we hurt by copying some stupid bytes over a cable? I can't imagine a large number at worst. Now, ever wondered how many men and women SOPA hurt last winter? In my case, how many days I spent posting articles and refreshing others to see what was happening, and how at some point I didn't even feel like eating thinking half of the internet was literally going to be erased (especially after google and wikipedia's blackouts when I realized stuff was really serious)?
Also, please don't twist my words. I never said that because I work for free it's automatically ok to download and steal everything in sight. I was just explaining that while some complain their works are being copied, others put as much effort into their works for the purpose of them being copied so others can enjoy them. And some of them have jobs that pay even less than producing media probably does... like selling stuff at the gas station. Both have rights of course... but not threatening another person's own. Again, this and initiatives like it don't threaten only pirates... they are practices that can be misunderstood and abused. Otherwise, I'm used to people considering us free developers and content creators leeches, who are worthless because we don't have a job (a few of us) when we contribute to the world for free in the same domains.
And that's exactly what I'm talking about. You and those companies are doing to the whole internet what you believe the internet is doing to you. Everything you said here is what I legitly said about media companies already. Again, this is proof that media companies declared a war with internet users in my view.
You are hoping my rights are taken away, by supporting attacks on the internet that could also affect non-pirates (or small downloads that everyone did in their life). That includes both this and SOPA / PIPA / ACTA. Also that new law which makes it illegal to sell a computer or mp3 player / iPod. Or another law against jailbreaking... which is making it illegal to install a custom operating system on a Playstation or Xbox in your own home and for your own use because Sony was pissed that day. Even to post about it on the internet and explain how it could be done (free speech anyone?). So... who's rights are taken away now?
And companies believe we users have no rights when they try to get websites to be censored and users to be taken down. How many men and women we hurt by copying some stupid bytes over a cable? I can't imagine a large number at worst. Now, ever wondered how many men and women SOPA hurt last winter? In my case, how many days I spent posting articles and refreshing others to see what was happening, and how at some point I didn't even feel like eating thinking half of the internet was literally going to be erased (especially after google and wikipedia's blackouts when I realized stuff was really serious)?
Also, please don't twist my words. I never said that because I work for free it's automatically ok to download and steal everything in sight. I was just explaining that while some complain their works are being copied, others put as much effort into their works for the purpose of them being copied so others can enjoy them. And some of them have jobs that pay even less than producing media probably does... like selling stuff at the gas station. Both have rights of course... but not threatening another person's own. Again, this and initiatives like it don't threaten only pirates... they are practices that can be misunderstood and abused. Otherwise, I'm used to people considering us free developers and content creators leeches, who are worthless because we don't have a job (a few of us) when we contribute to the world for free in the same domains.
Randy-Darkshade
Bike riding squirrel thing.
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
Please explain to me how people who are not doing anything illegal can be affected by this.
What rights of yours are being taken away? It's not your RIGHT to download things illegally, so what rights of yours ARE being affected?
Stupid bytes eh? So the games you play are stupid? the movies you watch are stupid? Just some stupid bytes that NO ONE obviously put effort into to fucking create for YOUR convenience, for YOUR entertainment and jerks like you think it's a RIGHT to copy that work and distribute it? fuck you.
Hah! You basically have said this throughout the thread though. You keep implying it's "our right" to download whatever the fuck we want regardless of content and who made it.
That's because they choose to create a software for people to use for free. This doesn't mean we have a right to download someones hardwork such as a movie or piece of music for free.I mean for fuck sake it's not like a single song cost's a lot these days. Albums don't really cost a lot, fuck me even DVD's don't cost much these days.
The thing is, those that charge for software do it as it's how they make their living. Like you said yourself many of those who create free programs do it voluntarily and usually have a job to which earns their income.
Please explain to me how people who are not doing anything illegal can be affected by this.
What rights of yours are being taken away? It's not your RIGHT to download things illegally, so what rights of yours ARE being affected?
Stupid bytes eh? So the games you play are stupid? the movies you watch are stupid? Just some stupid bytes that NO ONE obviously put effort into to fucking create for YOUR convenience, for YOUR entertainment and jerks like you think it's a RIGHT to copy that work and distribute it? fuck you.
Hah! You basically have said this throughout the thread though. You keep implying it's "our right" to download whatever the fuck we want regardless of content and who made it.
That's because they choose to create a software for people to use for free. This doesn't mean we have a right to download someones hardwork such as a movie or piece of music for free.I mean for fuck sake it's not like a single song cost's a lot these days. Albums don't really cost a lot, fuck me even DVD's don't cost much these days.
The thing is, those that charge for software do it as it's how they make their living. Like you said yourself many of those who create free programs do it voluntarily and usually have a job to which earns their income.
Mircea
Active Member
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
I just explained how non-pirates can be affected a few posts above. I'm taking part at this debate for 2 days on multiple forums, and am sick of repeating the same things all over. If something is unclear, see my previous posts. If you believe this sort of thing is ok, and that it's just stopping piracy without hurting the whole internet, invading users privacy and more, that's your belief. You, Term and others have your own view and we clearly won't get to an understanding. I did what felt right and helped inform people of this. Last thing I feel like doing is getting into a direct argue with supporters of this whole craze over internet freedom.
Like I said, I remain against any practice that involves taking down or censoring websites, or harassing users in real life for something they do on the net. I suggest companies find any other methods to fix the problem. Every anti-piracy initiative is about censoring websites and penalizing users, simply because they can't block some data being transferred. This by itself turns into a risk to the global network if turned into a common practice. If it keeps going further, it will eventually become illegal to do anything some "powers that be" will dislike, because of how easy it will become to censor things and how tempting. Sorry, I seen power hungry governments and companies too well to know where it goes. And I will never support or stand for such things.
Oh, and a correction: I never said the movies and games themselves are stupid... once again my words are being twisted. I said that the whole process is transferring some stupid bytes over a cable. Which in my eyes could never qualify as outright theft. Objects are objects, information is information, there are different base principles behind how each works. Copying some things is of course immoral and illegal... but as I said 100 times I consider it a highly gray area which is often unclear in many ways.
I just explained how non-pirates can be affected a few posts above. I'm taking part at this debate for 2 days on multiple forums, and am sick of repeating the same things all over. If something is unclear, see my previous posts. If you believe this sort of thing is ok, and that it's just stopping piracy without hurting the whole internet, invading users privacy and more, that's your belief. You, Term and others have your own view and we clearly won't get to an understanding. I did what felt right and helped inform people of this. Last thing I feel like doing is getting into a direct argue with supporters of this whole craze over internet freedom.
Like I said, I remain against any practice that involves taking down or censoring websites, or harassing users in real life for something they do on the net. I suggest companies find any other methods to fix the problem. Every anti-piracy initiative is about censoring websites and penalizing users, simply because they can't block some data being transferred. This by itself turns into a risk to the global network if turned into a common practice. If it keeps going further, it will eventually become illegal to do anything some "powers that be" will dislike, because of how easy it will become to censor things and how tempting. Sorry, I seen power hungry governments and companies too well to know where it goes. And I will never support or stand for such things.
Oh, and a correction: I never said the movies and games themselves are stupid... once again my words are being twisted. I said that the whole process is transferring some stupid bytes over a cable. Which in my eyes could never qualify as outright theft. Objects are objects, information is information, there are different base principles behind how each works. Copying some things is of course immoral and illegal... but as I said 100 times I consider it a highly gray area which is often unclear in many ways.
Last edited:
Term_the_Schmuck
Most Interesting Man on FAF
Re: Devastating internet censorship plan (new SOPA) to be put in practice starting Ju
Again, Wut? You're trying to turn this around on me? You're acting in the same manner that you accuse these companies of and suddenly you're right and they're wrong? Why? "My rights are more important." even though you never held the right to copy and distribute content which doesn't belong to you so the whole "rights" issue has absolutely nothin to do with the discussion.
Please quote exactly where I said people aren't entitled to their rights. You'll have a hard time finding that quote because it doesn't exist. Youre twistin my arguments to where you're hearing what you want to hear and any reasoned argument or why a company deserves to protect it's IPs just as any artist on FA deserves to protect there's suddenly makes that person some sort of facsist.
And as far as how this policy will effect the non-pirate, it will be extremely minimal considering THEY ARE GOING TO WARN YOU SIX TIMES BEFORE ANY ACTION IS TAKEN. If someone does something wrong without knowing then they have plenty of chances to make sure it doesn't happen again. You're acting like if someone gets caught downloading something once they're being sent to a gulag. You're exaggerating things just as CF always does.
I can't comment on some other random laws because A) I don't know what you're talking about, B) I can't confirm if you're just making things up and C) given how you're misrepresenting things in this thread using some baseless scare tactics which makes you look like an absolute fool, I can't believe any of those things you just brought up are worth any mention to begin with.
This thread is about that six-strike policy, buddy. How about we stick to that issue instead of going off on laws which have no bearing on this policy?
Please, you're just embarrassing yourself now.
"Based on my bullshit speculation companies want to become our overlords and the entire Internet which I base my whole worth on will be destroyed." I hope havin no job hasn't kept you from getting enough tin foil for your hats.
Let me tell you something, I live in the New York area. 11 years ago some assholes flew two planes into two of the tallest buildings in the world, killing thousands of people. And you know what, we got over it and realized that being paranoid over it happening again in the absence of a legit threat isnt with our time. Maybe you should calm the fuck down, go outside, meet a nice guy/girl and actually live your life instead of getting worked up on shit that won't fucking happen because it has nothing to do with what actually being discussed.
Great, so some people do open source shit. Good for them. That doesn't give you the right to force other companies from getting compensated for their products because "iluvdoggiedong69" releases something for Gary's Mod. And I'm pretty sure most people would be pissed if some guy took that mod and repackaged it to be sold, thus that person makes a profit off of someone else's work on a mod. Would you enjoy not seeing a cent of the money someone decides to make off of something you created? Now assuming you sold copies of that program you created, would you honestly be satisfied to know that the work you did and planned on getting compensated on was mass distributed to people for free?
Maybe you're not capable of answering that last question, because you clearly don't have a clue what its like to have to pay off a mortgage, car payments, bills, paying for groceries, taking care of dependents, etc. Youre still in the mindset of a guy living with his mom, not having anything bigger to worry about in his life aside from "will I be able to download movies for free" or something as ridiculous as cub porn.
Again, Wut? You're trying to turn this around on me? You're acting in the same manner that you accuse these companies of and suddenly you're right and they're wrong? Why? "My rights are more important." even though you never held the right to copy and distribute content which doesn't belong to you so the whole "rights" issue has absolutely nothin to do with the discussion.
Please quote exactly where I said people aren't entitled to their rights. You'll have a hard time finding that quote because it doesn't exist. Youre twistin my arguments to where you're hearing what you want to hear and any reasoned argument or why a company deserves to protect it's IPs just as any artist on FA deserves to protect there's suddenly makes that person some sort of facsist.
And as far as how this policy will effect the non-pirate, it will be extremely minimal considering THEY ARE GOING TO WARN YOU SIX TIMES BEFORE ANY ACTION IS TAKEN. If someone does something wrong without knowing then they have plenty of chances to make sure it doesn't happen again. You're acting like if someone gets caught downloading something once they're being sent to a gulag. You're exaggerating things just as CF always does.
I can't comment on some other random laws because A) I don't know what you're talking about, B) I can't confirm if you're just making things up and C) given how you're misrepresenting things in this thread using some baseless scare tactics which makes you look like an absolute fool, I can't believe any of those things you just brought up are worth any mention to begin with.
This thread is about that six-strike policy, buddy. How about we stick to that issue instead of going off on laws which have no bearing on this policy?
Please, you're just embarrassing yourself now.
"Based on my bullshit speculation companies want to become our overlords and the entire Internet which I base my whole worth on will be destroyed." I hope havin no job hasn't kept you from getting enough tin foil for your hats.
Let me tell you something, I live in the New York area. 11 years ago some assholes flew two planes into two of the tallest buildings in the world, killing thousands of people. And you know what, we got over it and realized that being paranoid over it happening again in the absence of a legit threat isnt with our time. Maybe you should calm the fuck down, go outside, meet a nice guy/girl and actually live your life instead of getting worked up on shit that won't fucking happen because it has nothing to do with what actually being discussed.
Great, so some people do open source shit. Good for them. That doesn't give you the right to force other companies from getting compensated for their products because "iluvdoggiedong69" releases something for Gary's Mod. And I'm pretty sure most people would be pissed if some guy took that mod and repackaged it to be sold, thus that person makes a profit off of someone else's work on a mod. Would you enjoy not seeing a cent of the money someone decides to make off of something you created? Now assuming you sold copies of that program you created, would you honestly be satisfied to know that the work you did and planned on getting compensated on was mass distributed to people for free?
Maybe you're not capable of answering that last question, because you clearly don't have a clue what its like to have to pay off a mortgage, car payments, bills, paying for groceries, taking care of dependents, etc. Youre still in the mindset of a guy living with his mom, not having anything bigger to worry about in his life aside from "will I be able to download movies for free" or something as ridiculous as cub porn.
Last edited: