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DO today's cartoons suck?

Do today's cartoons suck?

  • yes

    Votes: 22 88.0%
  • no

    Votes: 3 12.0%

  • Total voters
    25

Myoti

Member
The Skunk Cat and Rotsam pretty much said it for me.

People always talk so much about the 'nostalgia' of the older shows, so I went back and watched alot of these; most of 'em sucked about as much as the crappy ones today.

Most cartoons today don't have the same 'wide demograph' like they used to, I'll admit (like how Looney Tunes was a mixture of slapstick and suggestions of 'adult humor'), but being that we have the more adult stuff now (Family Guy, ATHF, etc.) I doubt it matters too much.
 
I'd have to agree on the nostalgia part. It's the same with me and some of my video games. Games I used to absolutely love when I was young are now more of just "good" today when I play them again (though some old games I still absolutely love even today, like Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask).

Admitted though yeah most of the older cartoons actually are pretty entertaining to me still today than some of the newer stuff. Tiny Toons, Animaniacs, Freakazoid, and ReBoot *surprised no one mentioned those two* are still better to me than some of the newer stuff. Of course I still like some newer cartoons like Chowder (which I wasn't expecting much from at first but was actually surprised by it), Avatar, Danny Phantom, and Foster's Home for Imaginary Friends. Spongebob may have better animation now, but the quality of the writing just seems to have gone down after the movie was completed.

As for teen/adult cartoons, I like Family Guy, Simpsons, Futurama, Metalocalypse, and The Venture Bros. Aqua Teen Hunger Force and South Park aren't really as funny lately as they used to be.
 

Wolf-Bone

Banned
Banned
Nostalgia has nothing to do with it. Anyone who knows anything about animation will tell you that animation principles are being ignored, character and background designs are increasingly getting dumbed down, and they won't somehow try to blame it on Flash, a fucking computer program for Christ's sake. Where their opinions will differ has to do with whether or not they're going to kiss the studio's asses and say any dumbing down of quality and relying too heavily on internet humor is fully justified if it means keeping production costs down. And if they themselves are animators, you can pretty much guarantee that as long as they think it's on the record, they'll tow the company line. And what you get is some kind of bizzarro-world logic, or lack thereof where if lower budgets are forcing production values down, but you're doing about the best that can be expected with said budget, you can say that today's cartoons are about as good as yesterday's cartoons because apparently quality has nothing to do with the final product anymore, it has to do with how you spent the budget.
 
Wolf-Bone said:
Nostalgia has nothing to do with it. Anyone who knows anything about animation will tell you that animation principles are being ignored, character and background designs are increasingly getting dumbed down, and they won't somehow try to blame it on Flash, a fucking computer program for Christ's sake. Where their opinions will differ has to do with whether or not they're going to kiss the studio's asses and say any dumbing down of quality and relying too heavily on internet humor is fully justified if it means keeping production costs down. And if they themselves are animators, you can pretty much guarantee that as long as they think it's on the record, they'll tow the company line. And what you get is some kind of bizzarro-world logic, or lack thereof where if lower budgets are forcing production values down, but you're doing about the best that can be expected with said budget, you can say that today's cartoons are about as good as yesterday's cartoons because apparently quality has nothing to do with the final product anymore, it has to do with how you spent the budget.

This might be true if your focus is the quality of the drawn animations and not the plot.
 

Mokusei_Kaze

Dream Weaver
I would have to say it's pretty 50/50. Since there is a higher demand for cartoons because of specialized stations focused on cartoons more cartoons are being made. And as a result you do see a lot more cartoons that are pretty much just blah. But on the same not... in the sea of traditional cartoons, flash, movies, anime, cgi movies, and claymation you find real gems among modern pieces.
 

Wolf-Bone

Banned
Banned
Rostam The Grey said:
Wolf-Bone said:
Nostalgia has nothing to do with it. Anyone who knows anything about animation will tell you that animation principles are being ignored, character and background designs are increasingly getting dumbed down, and they won't somehow try to blame it on Flash, a fucking computer program for Christ's sake. Where their opinions will differ has to do with whether or not they're going to kiss the studio's asses and say any dumbing down of quality and relying too heavily on internet humor is fully justified if it means keeping production costs down. And if they themselves are animators, you can pretty much guarantee that as long as they think it's on the record, they'll tow the company line. And what you get is some kind of bizzarro-world logic, or lack thereof where if lower budgets are forcing production values down, but you're doing about the best that can be expected with said budget, you can say that today's cartoons are about as good as yesterday's cartoons because apparently quality has nothing to do with the final product anymore, it has to do with how you spent the budget.

This might be true if your focus is the quality of the drawn animations and not the plot.

I think both are crap, but I care more about the former than the latter since televised cartoons have never exactly been known for awesome plots, with a few exceptions like Batman and Gargoyles.
 

Rilvor

Formal when angry
That is one thing I hate about cartoons. Things happen, and then unhappen next episode. Look, when Batman got his ass kicked, he wasn't magically back up and ready to fight next episode, he was usually seen in bandages if I recall correctly ._.

Most cartoons, and it isn't just today's cartoons either, the character can die and then be back next episode.

I watched Spongebob a couple times a few years ago after hearing all the cries of "OMFGZG ITS SO GUD!!1111! ITZ TEH FUNNEH!"

After those couple times, never again. I could feel my brain rotting, and my intelligence dropping every second ._.
 
But that was what was so great about Coyote and Roadrunner. He was always getting smashed, and always back to it the next second.
 

Rilvor

Formal when angry
Rostam The Grey said:
But that was what was so great about Coyote and Roadrunner. He was always getting smashed, and always back to it the next second.

True, but that was the whole point of the show, that's a slight difference than say, the character just up one day dieing, or having some body part being lost, then being magically fine next episode.
 
Ah the magic the animation... defying so many laws of logic and physics that if real life suddenly were to become like most cartoons then Issac Newton and Albert Einstein would be turning over in their graves. Continuity is almost non-existent in many of today's cartoons. The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy is a good example of virtually no continuity whatsoever. One episode the entire population of the Earth disappears; next episode the entire world is back to 6 billion people. In one scene Billy has lost all the skin on his face, scene transitions and he has no scratches whatsoever except for maybe one single bandage on his big nose (a common butt of many of his jokes). Some stuff like Avatar and Danny Phantom have continuity, and surprisingly even Fairly Odd Parents! does (Timmy just wishes for everything to be back to normal and "poof!" it happens; one episode even reveals where all of his "poofed back" wishes go as well). Hmm, but yeah many cartoons (old and new) aren't always known for having continuity anyway.
 

Le_Démon_Sans_Visage

evolution's cruelest joke
Rilvor said:
That is one thing I hate about cartoons. Things happen, and then unhappen next episode. Look, when Batman got his ass kicked, he wasn't magically back up and ready to fight next episode, he was usually seen in bandages if I recall correctly ._.

That's apples and oranges, though. Spongebob is a comedy aimed at little kids, Batman was action adventure and aimed at older kids & teens.
To be fair, sometimes the characters on Spongebob break the fourht wall (and wonder out loud how they managed to light a campfire underwater), and Batman had some nutty stuff - c'mon, a guy turning into a huge bat-monster? Totally unreal! ;)
 

Kyouryuu

Member
I'm just glad that the dumb card-based anime genre seems to be on the way out. You want to know when things started going downhill? It was when network executives decided they would import and popularize anime instead of creating new material. Yu-Gi-Oh and its clones were rather nauseating. Fortunately, I think US animation is on the rebound again, but we're definitely not without issues.

So where have things actually improved? In the non-dubbed cartoons, I really think the quality of voice acting has gone up. The other day, I was watching some old 1980s cartoons on YouTube and I was surprised at how over-the-top the voice acting was. Having one or two characters that play the irritating card is fine, but having an ensemble of them hurts the ears.

Similarly, I think we've gotten better at telling stories over the course of several episodes. This is an aspect that seems to have outpaced network executives, who still whimsically change schedules and episode orders around. We've also gotten better about telling stories on multiple levels. While Pixar is still probably the reigning king of this, the writers are more aware than ever that parents (or just big kids!) are watching too and leaving some jokes in for them will leave a better impression.

When you put Flash animation and aesthetics aside, though, I think the politically correct crowds are crippling the cartoon industry. Actually, I don't even know if "crowd" is the right word, since these things always seem to involve a handful of bigmouth puritans who have an axe to grind with anything that doesn't conform to their holier-than-thou version of morality. You ever think about why good guys and bad guys settle things over card duels over laser guns? Seriously, look at the Transformers movie from the 80s. Look at how many characters are getting offed, look at all of the lasers in the sky, look at all of the explosions. It's the quintessential 80s cartoon. Now, when was the last time you saw that kind of "violence" on Saturday morning?
 

BloodYoshi

Member
My method of determining wether something sucks or not is this: If someone made me sit in a room and forced me to watch/play something for a while, would I go crazy in a relatively short amount of time?

In this case, a resounding yes.
 

Shànwàng

Lavender Scented
It's a mixed bag. Every so often a great cartoon comes along and yet at the same time there are hundreds of terrible cartoons on at the same time. I used to love the Super Mario Bros Super Show, but upon reflection that show and the Sonic the Hedgehog cartoon shows were horrible. Batman: TAS remains one of the top shows I've ever watched (saw a few episodes the other day, DELIGHTFUL if I do say so myself.) But seriously, there are some good shows out there today. I'll be one of the first to say that if you don't like Courage the Cowardly Dog you're several slices of lame. I can't say Samurai Jack was all that great, first season was awesome, second season was terrible, third season was great, season four should never have been made which is probably why it never made it to season five. Fosters is a decent show that adequately hits its target audience but has enough humor for everyone to enjoy. As for the adult cartoons, there's good and bad, like always. Frankly, I'm too young to be getting into that "IN MY DAY CARTOONS WERE GOOD" bullshit because I know cartoons from my childhood sucked. Tiny Toons, good lord was that a horrible show. It's a mixed bag, that's all.
 

Tarrock

Member
I do think that many of todays shows are crap.
They almost all revolve around the same crap. What happened to good old shows like freakazoid, animanics, pinky and the brain, and earthworm jim on the WB? I don't even think the WB shows cartoons anymore. Last time I saw it they were showing crap like Johnny Test, Loonatics unleashed (super hero loony tunes....) and 7 reruns of yu-gi-oh. Hell I use to like yu-gi-oh but 7 episodes were to damn much.

Then we have more and more trash on cartoon network, along time ago we had shows like dexter's lab, johnny bravo, and a lot of the toonami stuff. Now we got stupid shit like the grim adventures of billy and mandy (i don't remember cartoons using as much gross humor as this show does when I was little), fosters home of imaginary friends (characters get annoying fast), and out of jimmy's head (wtf this ain't a cartoon).
Then what do we get on toonami? Oh we get 12 year old episodes of goosebumps, teen titans, what seems like 7 grueling hours of naruto, and 1 fucken episode of DBZ. 1 episode a fucken week ain't enough to get people into the show, no we have to show what 2-3 fucken episodes of naturo, which spews endless shit every episode.

Wished we'd get weekday toonami back with DBZ in it, and someone would pick up the rights for Earthworm Jim and freakazoid and make new episodes.

This subject pisses me off, all i really watch anymore is adult swim, comedy central, and history channel cause of the crap cartoons on anymore.
 

Rilvor

Formal when angry
Tarrock said:
I do think that many of todays shows are crap.
They almost all revolve around the same crap. What happened to good old shows like freakazoid, animanics, pinky and the brain, and earthworm jim on the WB? I don't even think the WB shows cartoons anymore. Last time I saw it they were showing crap like Johnny Test, Loonatics unleashed (super hero loony tunes....) and 7 reruns of yu-gi-oh. Hell I use to like yu-gi-oh but 7 episodes were to damn much.

Then we have more and more trash on cartoon network, along time ago we had shows like dexter's lab, johnny bravo, and a lot of the toonami stuff. Now we got stupid shit like the grim adventures of billy and mandy (i don't remember cartoons using as much gross humor as this show does when I was little), fosters home of imaginary friends (characters get annoying fast), and out of jimmy's head (wtf this ain't a cartoon).
Then what do we get on toonami? Oh we get 12 year old episodes of goosebumps, teen titans, what seems like 7 grueling hours of naruto, and 1 fucken episode of DBZ. 1 episode a fucken week ain't enough to get people into the show, no we have to show what 2-3 fucken episodes of naturo, which spews endless shit every episode.

Wished we'd get weekday toonami back with DBZ in it, and someone would pick up the rights for Earthworm Jim and freakazoid and make new episodes.

This subject pisses me off, all i really watch anymore is adult swim, comedy central, and history channel cause of the crap cartoons on anymore.

and the sad thing is, even most of adult swim sucks these days. What the fuck is Tom Goes To the Mayor, Tim and Eric Awesome Show, Saul of the Molemen, Shin Chan, 12 Oz Mouse, Squidbillies, and more. Oh and Aqua Teen Hunger Force, the humor is crap, I usually find myself staring at the wall because the episodes are usually that boring.
 

Porsupah

bunneh
I'll go with the No Nostalgia brigade. ^_^ There's good stuff now, there's been good stuff in the past, and probably in much the same proportions. Gods know, I don't want to survive more hideous made-for-TV 80s animation, where as little as possible gets redrawn between frames, and everyone's as supple as an action figure.

Good stuff now or in the last few years? I'd definitely go with Futurama for one (Simpsons.. eh, there've been some reasonable eps here and there lately, but there's only so much life in just about any show), the gorgeously animated Adventures of Peter Rabbit, and Dogstar's a load of fun. I've heard some good words on the TV version of Watership Down, but still haven't been able to see any. Oh, and definitely Invader Zim. ^_^ And then there's anime, of course - Dennou Coil, Kaiji, Bokurano, Higurashi no Naku Koro ni, Princess Tutu, Jungle wa itsumo Hale nochi Guu, Kemonozume, Darker than Black..
 

Poetigress

Panthera tigris libris
Tarrock said:
Then we have more and more trash on cartoon network, along time ago we had shows like dexter's lab, johnny bravo, and a lot of the toonami stuff.

Anybody know what happened to... uh... Tartakovsky? The guy who created Dexter's Lab and a lot of the others? Is he still around somewhere, or is the overall decline because he packed up and went someplace else?

Rilvor said:
and the sad thing is, even most of adult swim sucks these days.

The only thing I've watched on Adult Swim is Robot Chicken (two favorite bits: the stages of giraffe death, and Darth Vader calling to say that the Death Star was destroyed). Even that's hit-or-miss, though, and I think the newer eps of that seem more focused on what they can get away with than what's truly funny. And, I wouldn't call it a cartoon, really.

Oh, and I've watched some of the repeats of Space Ghost: Coast to Coast. I miss that. Again, though, not really a cartoon IMO.

Porsupah said:
I've heard some good words on the TV version of Watership Down, but still haven't been able to see any.

*blinks* Where is that shown? (Then again, considering the lame TV versions of both Redwall and Silverwing, I shouldn't hold out hope.)
 

Ainoko

The Wild And Crazy Hybrid
DARKWOLFE said:
i can,t answer with a yes or no to me it,s more like alot do but then there are a good number that don,t but i guess if those two answers are the only choices then i,ll say yes


I have to agree with you on this. There is a disparingly few good if not decent cartoons on TV today. Hell even the classics are getting cencored today due to thier overt violence and racial innuendos. I have a few favorites today that I love to watch, however, they are rarely on TV, such as Kids Next Door, Cow and Chicken, Dexter;s Laboratory, just to name a few.
 

NerdyMunk

Only a Book Smart Nerd
wyanewill said:
Well do they? After watching stuff like Family Guy and Futurama, I call that a big yes.

No, because of Avatar: The Last Airbender
 

Raul

MSPicasso Maestro
You know not all "new" cartoons are that bad. The new Batman cartoon (The Batman) wasn't so bad. Okay, so they redesigned the villains, but the violence was good, and there was plenty of it. The new TMNT cartoon, while not great, is still TMNT.

But I think we can all agree that the "Golden Age" of children's cartoons was the 80s and 90s. Okay, so the animation during the 80s was crap, but the cartoons were awesome! We had genius such as Transformers, Thundercats, Masters of the Universe, Captain Planet, Batman:The Animated Series (90s) etcetera.

Now we have shit like Action Man: Atom, and other huge piles of crap
 

Mianame

New Member
Raul said:
But I think we can all agree that the "Golden Age" of children's cartoons was the 80s and 90s. Okay, so the animation during the 80s was crap, but the cartoons were awesome! We had genius such as Transformers, Thundercats, Masters of the Universe, Captain Planet, Batman:The Animated Series (90s) etcetera.

Don't forget Pirates of Dark Water! Oh, and Swat Cats. Who doesn't love Swat Cats?

I have to agree with all of this. I think what really upsets me is just how gross the new cartoons get. Things such as Billy and Mandy I find myself unable to watch along with Camp Lazlo and a few others. I could withstand the lack of humor and the animation I don't even favor if so much of the shows didn't revolve around things like fart jokes.
 

WolfoxOkamichan

Luffs Buff Wuffs
Crappy nostalgia blinds. They forget the crappy episodes on the supposed great shows.

There are new toons that are good - TMNT (pre-Fast Forward) blows away the old TMNT because it relies on story, characterization and action instead of cheesiness, campness and one-liners; DCAU's Justice League and Batman Beyond are awesome enough to show you that superheroes can have dark stories. Invader Zim is a proof of black comedy. Futurama uses pop-culture jokes and mixes it with inside jokes, showing a good formula.

Don't let taste and nostalgia blind you into thinking what is "better". Not to sound like an angry person, but really, I dislike it when people scream like old people falling into the golden age fallacy. I really don't want to shoot the gun.
 
Yeah, for the most part, todays cartoons suck. (Spider riders, what the hell?!)
 
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