Evolution VS Creationism

[CaptainCool]

Well, there you go. God created light already in motion, in order to give the appearance of a universe more than 6,000 years old.

:V

I couldn't remember on which day gawd supposedly did stuff so I googled it and ended up on this poor excuse of a website: http://www.missiontoamerica.com/genesis/days-of-creation.html
They believe dinos and humans lived together and that they were both vegetarians... Yeah, because a velociraptor with razor sharp teeth was totally a vegetarian :V

 

[Aleu]

So I actually did some real biblical verse research instead of relying on a looney site :V

"
1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
[SUP]9 [/SUP]And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And the evening and the morning were the third day.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
[SUP]18 [/SUP]And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.
[SUP]21 [/SUP]And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply in the earth.
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And the evening and the morning were the fifth day.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
[SUP]27 [/SUP]So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them."

So Earth wasn't first. It was day and night. Earth was just some...void thing.

 

[CaptainCool]

I actually get how they made that stuff up. Because when you see Genesis in order it actually makes sense. First there was nothing, then there was some "void-like" thing which was then formed into a better shape and so on and so forth. I can totally see the logic behind it, it was the best they were able to come up with at the time.

What makes me sad is that people still do believe in it today even though we do know better now >__>

 

[Aleu]

What I find interesting is that in that paragraph...thing...it talks about how God made man and woman in his image...but then talks about Adam and Eve separately. It's kinda foggy on whether or not the supposed man and woman from before are the same. Kinda puts a hole in the whole "Adam and Eve not Steve" argument. For all we know that COULD have been Steve :V

 

[CaptainCool]

Yeah, it's very foggy at best. Who knows what was lost in translation after all those years.

 

[Aleu]

Yeah, it's very foggy at best. Who knows what was lost in translation after all those years.

The Vatican.

seriously they have dozens of books that for some reason weren't part of the Bible. That's why I can't take anyone who says The Bible is the literal word of God seriously (well there's dozens of reasons but that's the only one that doesn't involve science)

 

[CaptainCool]

The Vatican.

seriously they have dozens of books that for some reason weren't part of the Bible. That's why I can't take anyone who says The Bible is the literal word of God seriously (well there's dozens of reasons but that's the only one that doesn't involve science)

Oh man, can you imagine what they are hiding in there? X3 Rumor has it that if those documents are ever released it would essentially wreck christianity

 

[Hooky]

So the bible is somewhat of a chinese whisper. I think people may need to look over their documents and realise that it was just used to simplify and understand the world eons ago. You know, to make the world seem less of an unknown mess (of a fear) by bringing in concepts of the world from societal traits of the time.

 

[Fallowfox]

My first degree was in anthropology and if you look at the creation story it fits very nicely when you stretch it out. You can not remove a bible verse from it historical, cultural and historic context and have it still be true. The creation story had to be in an understandable format for the people of the tmes. I figure I will ask God when I get there.
I would not want to believe in a God I can understand, why sweat the small stuff?

It surprises me someone who studies human culture and presumably appreciates that there is a large number of conflicting religions, can still believe the religion they happen to have been born into is the one true religion, or that any of that religion's claims- whether it be that there is a god, paradise, a life force, chakras etc, are anything other than their own culture's invention.

Actually since this information is so freely available, it puzzles me that the great majority of humans with access to that information, conclude the very same.

We're just highly derived monkeys. Was there a point in our evolution from the most primitive tetrapod that the immortal space monkey that God is usually represented as decided 'this group of primates is similar enough to me now that I will give them an immortal consciousness that I will judge upon its moral choices,'.

But the icing on the cake is that, given this event is so unbelievable, God apparently decided to give the monkeys a book to prove it, being fully aware that hundreds of other tribes of monkeys had already made books with the incorrect nature of God recorded in them that are indistinguishable from the 'true' book.

It's just like....wah!?

 

[Lobar]

But the icing on the cake is that, given this event is so unbelievable, God apparently decided to give the monkeys a book to prove it, being fully aware that hundreds of other tribes of monkeys had already made books with the incorrect nature of God recorded in them that are indistinguishable from the 'true' book.

It's just like....wah!?

Just some of the monkeys, too. There were some other monkeys on the other side of the planet that were left to remain ignorant (and presumably suffer the eternal consequences thereof) for centuries until the rest of the monkeys found them.

 

[CaptainCool]

It surprises me someone who studies human culture and presumably appreciates that there is a large number of conflicting religions, can still believe the religion they happen to have been born into is the one true religion, or that any of that religion's claims- whether it be that there is a god, paradise, a life force, chakras etc, are anything other than their own culture's invention.

Actually since this information is so freely available, it puzzles me that the great majority of humans with access to that information, conclude the very same.

We're just highly derived monkeys. Was there a point in our evolution from the most primitive tetrapod that the immortal space monkey that God is usually represented as decided 'this group of primates is similar enough to me now that I will give them an immortal consciousness that I will judge upon its moral choices,'.

But the icing on the cake is that, given this event is so unbelievable, God apparently decided to give the monkeys a book to prove it, being fully aware that hundreds of other tribes of monkeys had already made books with the incorrect nature of God recorded in them that are indistinguishable from the 'true' book.

It's just like....wah!?

Well obviously those other monkeys are just false prophets. Like FLAREON. They worship false idols, like the DOME FOSSIL.

We are talking about brainwashed loonatics here, you can't rationally explain why they believe what they believe even though there is a ton of evidence that demonstrates that they are wrong.

 

[Nikolinni]

Well obviously those other monkeys are just false prophets. Like FLAREON. They worship false idols, like the DOME FOSSIL.

We are talking about brainwashed loonatics here, you can't rationally explain why they believe what they believe even though there is a ton of evidence that demonstrates that they are wrong.

Some of them don't even know why they believe what they believe. Oh sure any given Christian should be able to rattle off what Jesus' death meant, but try pressing them to the level I've been pressed on this board. You'd prolly be able to trip them up sooner or later.

In fact according to one of my Christian friends, I know more about the bible and had read it more than your average churchgoer. Now that's just sad. Guys, there's more in your bible than just what the pastor says to read.

 

[Duality Jack]

Yeah, it's very foggy at best. Who knows what was lost in translation after all those years.

Amusingly enough you can find that out rather easily, there are scholars dedicated to such things. (I have one in the family)

For example, in the old versions Virgin Mary was not a Virgin, and the phrase where "virgin marry" arrived first was a repeated mistranslation over several generations which started as "Mary Married"

Not only to mention 50 years before it was printed via press the bible was actually significantly longer, as those elements showed jesus being a dick as a kid, they where removed before the bible was spread as widely. Cool things.

One can still find these older bibles kicking about, the bishop up here has one and has talked about it's changes a few times.

 

[Nikolinni]

Amusingly enough you can find that out rather easily, there are scholars dedicated to such things. (I have one in the family)

For example, in the old versions Virgin Mary was not a Virgin, and the phrase where "virgin marry" arrived first was a repeated mistranslation over several generations which started as "Mary Married"

Not only to mention 50 years before it was printed via press the bible was actually significantly longer, as those elements showed jesus being a dick as a kid, they where removed before the bible was spread as widely. Cool things.

One can still find these older bibles kicking about, the bishop up here has one and has talked about it's changes a few times.

I think Perri linked me to one of those one time. I didn't read much of it at the time since I was still in my hardwired Christian phase, but she's done some fine looking-into when it comes to the bible.

Believe it or not she's actually one of the main reasons why I stopped being Christian >____>

 

[CaptainCool]

Amusingly enough you can find that out rather easily, there are scholars dedicated to such things. (I have one in the family)

For example, in the old versions Virgin Mary was not a Virgin, and the phrase where "virgin marry" arrived first was a repeated mistranslation over several generations which started as "Mary Married"

Not only to mention 50 years before it was printed via press the bible was actually significantly longer, as those elements showed jesus being a dick as a kid, they where removed before the bible was spread as widely. Cool things.

One can still find these older bibles kicking about, the bishop up here has one and has talked about it's changes a few times.

Ha! I can see how these parts would be a problem
But it still baffles me how people see the bible as "the word of god" when it is so very obvious that it was changed over time. It's not even hidden, you can look that stuff up!

I think Perri linked me to one of those one time. I didn't read much of it at the time since I was still in my hardwired Christian phase, but she's done some fine looking-into when it comes to the bible.

Believe it or not she's actually one of the main reasons why I stopped being Christian >____>

Reading the bible and thinking about what it says is actually very often the first step away from christianity. If you are not entirely uneducated and if you have an average general knowledge about most stuff you will see the bible as complete nonsense when you actively read it.

 

[Ozriel]

I actually get how they made that stuff up. Because when you see Genesis in order it actually makes sense. First there was nothing, then there was some "void-like" thing which was then formed into a better shape and so on and so forth. I can totally see the logic behind it, it was the best they were able to come up with at the time.

What makes me sad is that people still do believe in it today even though we do know better now >__>

Have you ever looked into Arius and what he thought Christianity was supposed to be? It's interesting to read.

I couldn't remember on which day gawd supposedly did stuff so I googled it and ended up on this poor excuse of a website: http://www.missiontoamerica.com/genesis/days-of-creation.html
They believe dinos and humans lived together and that they were both vegetarians... Yeah, because a velociraptor with razor sharp teeth was totally a vegetarian :V

If dinosaurs existed when Homo Sapiens did, we'd be still living in caves. :V

 

[CaptainCool]

Have you ever looked into Arius and what he thought Christianity was supposed to be? It's interesting to read.




If dinosaurs existed when Homo Sapiens did, we'd be still living in caves. :V

I have not! I'll look into it if I remember.

Their example for dinos being vegetarians is the giant panda because those have sharp teeth as well... The irony is that panda teeth are actually a way better example for evolution

 

[Fernin]

Round and round and round it still goes!

 

[CaptainCool]

Well, so far we didn't have a hardcore creationist in the thread and things are going rather smoothly right now so who cares? :3

 

[Hakar Kerarmor]

Well, so far we didn't have a hardcore creationist in the thread and things are going rather smoothly right now so who cares? :3

Well, it's rather difficult to have a debate on evolution/creation when the only people talking either think evolution is true, or evolution is true but has an intelligent force behind it.
What we need is someone who thinks that evolution is bunk and God created the Earth 6000+ years ago because his holy book says so.

Then again, it's rather difficult to debate with them too.

 

[CaptainCool]

Well, it's rather difficult to have a debate on evolution/creation when the only people talking either think evolution is true, or evolution is true but has an intelligent force behind it.
What we need is someone who thinks that evolution is bunk and God created the Earth 6000+ years ago because his holy book says so.

Then again, it's rather difficult to debate with them too.

That's the problem when dealing with facts vs. opinions.
Evolution is a fact. The only way to argue in it's favor is to explain the evidence and to give examples for it.
If someone believes there is a mystical driving force behind it.... What are you supposed to do? The only way to argue against that is to demand evidence for it... They don't have evidence and "how dare you question our opinion which we are entitled to?!" >__> So that starts going in circles since you can't really argue in favor of an unfalsifiable entitiy.

And dealing with the super creatards isn't really what I would call "debating" either. Their only "argument" is "the bible said so! >:C" so all you can do is demand proper evidence, and at that point they just stop listening because they are brainwashed loonies.