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Furries, Stop self loathing and stand up for yourselves!

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Axleonder

Domestic cat with a tailball

I put together the video for this guy myself, he does the voice.

He's not even furry, but he can see what's going on, between the furries and these "other" nerds who don't stand up for themselves.

Too often I see furries desperate to fit into societal expectations to win approval, when a. it's mainly these other nerds who pick on furry for sexual weirdness, so why aren't they being called out instead? and b. these other nerds do not get respect for doing this anyway.
 

Mambi

Fun loving kitty cat
People need to loosen up in general. Furry fandom is no different than literally ANY other fandom...Star Trek,Harry Potter, X-men, sports teams, no difference. People enjoy the art of their hobby, they dress up, and they have a sense of community and shared fun, but somehow Furry gets picked on because it's "weird". Well news to everyone...EVERYTHING is weird to someone. It's people having fun causing no harm at all...so where lies the problem? Dunno...

Watch the next time that sports fans, for example, poke fun of Furries, then watch them in groups painting their faces and dressing up in weird outfits in order to enjoy THEIR activity. Who's the weird one? LOL
 

Troj

Your Friendly Neighborhood Dino Therapist
The desperation to "clean up the fandom" only serves to reinforce the suspicion that the fandom requires special cleaning. Some furries do absolutely need to learn discretion, boundaries, consent, and "time-and-place," but the same can also be said for many non-furries as well.

Mind you, I absolutely think everybody should want to be a good ambassador for the fandom, and should care about its larger reputation, but it's about time we dumped the moldy old neuroses that compel us to apologize for "that" CSI episode and for our whole existence right out of the gate. It's about time we owned who we are in a positive way, and showed some pride in it (without becoming overbearing, pushy, or "cringey," of course).
 
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Axleonder

Domestic cat with a tailball
Troj, saying "everybody should want to be a good ambassador for the fandom", is over-thinking and putting burdens on it. Do gamers think "I want to be a good ambassador for gaming"? ...No. They just want to play their games and enjoy themselves. The same should be said for furry. Guys just want to enjoy themselves and not have to think about this stuff.

Why is it your frame of reference still revolves around us fans needing to perform for others?
 

Mambi

Fun loving kitty cat
Agreed, be proud of what you like, especially since it's harmless and there is literally nothing wrong with it at all! Everyone has to be true to themselves because you have to live with yourself 24/7 and cannot escape. Why not be honest and happy?

What gets me is the moment you mention "furry", far too many people instantly picture a large yiff pile and suits with lots of holes, and nothing else. They barely even consider art or play or even animal mannerisms for fun...they lock onto sex as the reason and can't fathom otherwise, even when you explain it. We're just instantly assumed to be sexual deviants! I mean, I AM one of course, but it has nothing to do with Furriness, just like most people <LOL>.

But other groups don't get this...nobody assumes that Star Wars fans are having orgy's dressed like slave girl princesses and creatively using their light-sabers...nobody assumes that all fans of Game of Thrones are re-enacting red weddings at their conventions, but Furry goes straight to sex in their heads <sigh>. It's just so wrong...I limit my furry orgies to 2 a day just like everyone else, dammit! <ROTFLMAO>

Troj, you put it best, there is nothing TO clean up in the fandom, except the things PUT there by those who just don't bother to learn about it.
 

Mambi

Fun loving kitty cat
Troj, saying "everybody should want to be a good ambassador for the fandom", is over-thinking and putting burdens on it. Do gamers think "I want to be a good ambassador for gaming"? ...No. They just want to play their games and enjoy themselves. The same should be said for furry. Guys just want to enjoy themselves and not have to think about this stuff.

Why is it your frame of reference still revolves around us fans needing to perform for others?

I think he just meant "Don't be an asshole" in general, and try not to play up the stereotype for laughs, despite the temptation. That and don't be ashamed of who you are and what you like..not literally an ambassador of good will and understanding. I agree with you, I didn't sign up for a war against idiots, I just want to have fun! But at the same time if I can help someone understand that simply fact without being rude or pushy, why not?
 

Axleonder

Domestic cat with a tailball
What gets me is the moment you mention "furry", far too many people instantly picture a large yiff pile and suits with lots of holes, and nothing else. They barely even consider art or play or even animal mannerisms for fun...
These people who fixate on sexual activity, are performing a form of gay bashing. They don't like the idea that there's men hiding in costumes who might be getting sex. That's why they do it. They actually wouldn't mind if furry was full of girls being sexually nasty. They are hysterical against male sexuality. You need to point this out against them. Not try and prove "it's not ALL sexual activity!". They have to be opposed on principle.
 

Troj

Your Friendly Neighborhood Dino Therapist
Yes, I meant "don't be an asshole." Don't trash hotels. Don't be rude. Don't be creepy. Done "dine-and-dash," and tip waiters and other staff fairly. Respect others' rules and boundaries. Be the positive change you want to see in the world. Particularly in situations where people will identify you as a member of the fandom, make an effort to at least be decent and considerate to those around you.

Well, and given that normies do like to ask about the fandom, I think it's also a good idea to have a little shpiel ready, so you don't just stand there stammering and sweating like a murder suspect.

Gamers are developing a negative reputation in some circles because they either don't care or haven't thought about how their individual behaviors and choices are shaping public perceptions of their community. A few bad apples end up spoiling everything for everybody.
 
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Axleonder

Domestic cat with a tailball
Gamers are developing a negative reputation in some circles because they either don't care or haven't thought about how their individual behaviors and choices are shaping public perceptions of their community.
No, gamers have a negative reputation because it's largely guys enjoying things by themselves, and that's not allowed. That's why their individual behavior is treated as not acceptable.

We don't see this picking on individual behavior against women who enjoy Fifty Shades or Days of Our Lives.
 

Fallowfox

Are we moomin, or are we dancer?
Well, now that Ren and Stimpy cartoon is in my brain forever!

Anyway, yes I agree with the presenter in the video that gay-bashing and furry-bashing have a big overlap.
 

PercyD

Lover of Beasty Baes
No, gamers have a negative reputation because it's largely guys enjoying things by themselves, and that's not allowed. That's why their individual behavior is treated as not acceptable.

We don't see this picking on individual behavior against women who enjoy Fifty Shades or Days of Our Lives.
....?
Do you even know what women like? Just curious. Cause you named things my 70 year old mom would like *Squint*

Gamers have a negative reputation because there are some really loud really raunchy individuals out there. Point period. Sheer fact that you can't name "things women like" thats not actually something associated with 50+ women means you really don't have a foot to stand on in this argument.
 

Axleonder

Domestic cat with a tailball
Why does the age matter, PercyD? You didn't even refute what I said.

Anyway, how about yaoi as another example? Yaoi is mainly enjoyed by girls, lots of them are young and definitely not the "50+" category. Go to a yaoi youtube comments section, and you'll see universal praise when someone time-stamps the favorite "nasty" bits. No one is beating each other over the heads for knowing what they're into.


Here, I'll help you:
 

Liseran Thistle

They/Them
Why does the age matter, PercyD? You didn't even refute what I said.

Anyway, how about yaoi as another example? Yaoi is mainly enjoyed by girls, lots of them are young and definitely not the "50+" category. Go to a yaoi youtube comments section, and you'll see everyone just pleasantly enjoying themselves, and universal praise when someone time-stamps the important bits. No one is beating each other over the heads for knowing what they're into.


Here, I'll help you:

I don't think you've seen enough of the Yaoi community to know that lots of people actually fucking hate Fujoshis (Women who like Yaoi.)
 

PercyD

Lover of Beasty Baes
Why does the age matter, PercyD? You didn't even refute what I said.

Anyway, how about yaoi as another example? Yaoi is mainly enjoyed by girls, lots of them are young and definitely not the "50+" category. Go to a yaoi youtube comments section, and you'll see everyone just pleasantly enjoying themselves, and universal praise when someone time-stamps the important bits. No one is beating each other over the heads for knowing what they're into.


Here, I'll help you:
Actually I did. And you can go back up and reread my comment too.

And uh, no? Yaoi-fans, particularly women, aren't respected. In fact women and the things that they like aren't respected in general. When all the reboots were happening, "girl's media" took a back seat. I can count the reboots for girl's media with wide aclaim on one hand, and Netflix's Shera is only a thing because Netflix has a lot of money to take risks.

But I think this is a strawman argument when talking about how the furry fandom is treated. Women aren't treated inheretly better in any way shape or fashion. This is just a grab to shit talk about women for some strange reason. Sounds like its a personal bias of yours.
 

Axleonder

Domestic cat with a tailball
No. You two are out of touch if you think you think "Fujoshis" are hated to any real world extent. (not just from resentful low-status nerds.)

And the youtube comments section I linked is full of fans just pleasantly enjoying, and universally (or near-universally) praising what they like.
 

PercyD

Lover of Beasty Baes
No. You two are out of touch if you think you think "Fujoshis" are hated to any real world extent. (not just from resentful low-status nerds.)

And the youtube comments section I linked is full of fans just pleasantly enjoying, and universally (or near-universally) praising what they like.
So...
You go to a community and you are somehow trying to make an argument about how they don't hate themselves...?
???
 

Axleonder

Domestic cat with a tailball
Yes, and the furry community has a hard time not hating themselves.

Like this protogen fursuit head video I clicked on, and the top 2nd comment was seeking validation from people who hate furries, by talking about "the fandom's incredibly talented artists, fursuit makers etc.", in an otherwise perfectly innocuous video.
 

PercyD

Lover of Beasty Baes
Yes, and the furry community has a hard time not hating themselves.

Like this protogen fursuit head video I clicked on, and the top 2nd comment was seeking validation from people who hate furries, by talking about "the fandom's incredibly talented artists, fursuit makers etc.", in an otherwise perfectly innocuous video.
...?
But you were saying that women somehow are privileged because... they dont hate themselves?
????
-Okay, this is a non-argument.
 

Axleonder

Domestic cat with a tailball
They don't get the same widespread scrutiny for their individual behavior, nor the shared anxiety over what they enjoy. How is this difficult to understand?
 

Troj

Your Friendly Neighborhood Dino Therapist
We don't see this picking on individual behavior against women who enjoy Fifty Shades or Days of Our Lives.

Actually, you do. Hobbies seen as "feminine" are often taken less seriously and seen as less "serious" than hobbies that are seen as "masculine." Compare popular/mainstream reactions to Twilight, with, oh, Ready Player One, or take note of the common dismissive attitude towards "don't count as REAL games" mobile games like Candy Crush.

Similarly, hobbies seen as "nerdy" or "geeky" have also traditionally been mocked. That mockery has started to subside as some of these interests have become more mainstream---but, some of those old biases have continued to seep out in new or coded forms, too.

Anyway, I agree that furries need to leave that "CSI shame" in the past where it belongs, and realize that the furry fandom is just a fandom like any other, and that there's absolutely nothing wrong with liking anthropomorphic animal characters--hell, I'd even go a step further and say that there's also nothing inherently wrong with having attractions to anthro characters, either! (Even Buzzfeed admits that Robin Hood and Lola Bunny are sexy, after all, so furry crushes are more common than many people would like to admit.)

At the same time, each of us still needs to take responsibility for our own behavior, and for the part we play in making the fandom what it is. Have fun and express yourself, but don't be a creep or an asshole.
 
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