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Deleted member 82554

Guest
Ah, you’re a Jehovah’s Witness.
Actually I'm not.

In any case, both Christens and Jehovah's Witnesses have their own interpretations of what God actually is, but who is to say whomever is right?

Personally, I'm on the fence about both.
 

jtrekkie

Feathered
For reference, Jehovah is a late substitute for the Tetragrammaton meaning "my Lord" (from Adonai). We like to avoid it because Adonai is used elsewhere and can be confused with Jesus himself or normal people who are sometimes called "lord". That's one of the reasons most Christians will tell you Jehovah is Jesus, Felix got the other. As far as the word goes neither is wrong, per se, but it is a cause of confusion.
 

Felix Bernard

Chemist, Conservative, Mark Levin fan
Actually I'm not.

In any case, both Christens and Jehovah's Witnesses have their own interpretations of what God actually is, but who is to say whomever is right?

Personally, I'm on the fence about both.

I recommend Dr. James White’s book “The Forgotten Trinity.” The Scripture is very clear on who God is, and if we use Sola Scriptura (Scripture alone) for matters of faith we will find this conclusion to be the only working one. This is about right and wrong - who God is is a central and essential doctrine in the Christian faith. Getting that wrong is getting the faith wrong.
 
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FluffyShutterbug

Guest
I recommend Dr. James White’s book “The Forgotten Trinity.” The Scripture is very clear on who God is, and if we use Sola Scriptura (Scripture alone) for matters of faith we will find this conclusion to be the only working one. This is about right and wrong - who God is is a central and essential doctrine in the Christian faith. Getting that wrong is getting the faith wrong.
There isn't really a right or wrong answer when it comes to religion. How can we possibly know what's right or wrong in that respect?
 

Felix Bernard

Chemist, Conservative, Mark Levin fan
There isn't really a right or wrong answer when it comes to religion. How can we possibly know what's right or wrong in that respect?

Just for a joke... just to lighten up the mood here xD

I can totally make fun of myself.
 

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Felix Bernard

Chemist, Conservative, Mark Levin fan
There isn't really a right or wrong answer when it comes to religion. How can we possibly know what's right or wrong in that respect?

But to answer your question seriously: I believe there is a right and wrong because we have a perspicuous Scripture which alone is the infallible rule of faith.
 

Saiko

GTWT Survivor
I personally find the whole Trinity three-for-one thing to be an inconsequential detail in the grand scheme of things. It doesn’t really matter how god is split or merged if all the choices yield the same character and philosophy, and we’re not supposed to be able to comprehend that part of his being anyway.
 

Felix Bernard

Chemist, Conservative, Mark Levin fan
I personally find the whole Trinity three-for-one thing to be an inconsequential detail in the grand scheme of things. It doesn’t really matter how god is split or merged if all the choices yield the same character and philosophy, and we’re not supposed to be able to comprehend that part of his being anyway.

We can fully understand the incarnation then. And if we do not fully understand the incarnation, we cannot fully understand the importance and power of the atonement. In other words, is Christ is not the very substance of God - there is no real atonement for sin.
 
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FluffyShutterbug

Guest
But to answer your question seriously: I believe there is a right and wrong because we have a perspicuous Scripture which alone is the infallible rule of faith.
But, how do you know that the scripture is infallible? Just saying it doesn't make it so.
 
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FluffyShutterbug

Guest
Once again, asking "why" is necessary. Why do you feel this way? Why do you think this is true? I'll gladly hear you out, but saying that something's true just because it is true isn't a valid argument. Remember, 500 years ago or so, most Christians believed that the earth was flat and that the earth was the center of the universe. They thought that concept was infallible.
 

Felix Bernard

Chemist, Conservative, Mark Levin fan

Felix Bernard

Chemist, Conservative, Mark Levin fan
Once again, asking "why" is necessary. Why do you feel this way? Why do you think this is true? I'll gladly hear you out, but saying that something's true just because it is true isn't a valid argument. Remember, 500 years ago or so, most Christians believed that the earth was flat and that the earth was the center of the universe. They thought that concept was infallible.

*They* thought the concept was infallible. The Scripture make no clear teaching on it. The Bible is not a science book - it doesn’t make scientific claims. It makes Theological claims.
 
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FluffyShutterbug

Guest
Heh, my friends are right. This is getting me nowhere at all. Once again, saying that something's true because it's true isn't a valid point, but I can't do this anymore. I won't participate in a zero-sum game. Smell ya later!
If someone can't use logic to articulate themselves, then, I can't use logic to argue against them.
 
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Deleted member 82554

Guest
So, you're saying that Mr. Fox is wrong?
I'm never wrong. If anyone says I am, they're lying. :V
Uhh..... That's kinda harsh.
Not really. The two faiths share so many similarities there is bound to be some overlap.
OhHhHhHh shiiiiit its a a fox fight
And you know there is only one way a fox fight can end. :^)
*Boops Mr. Fox on the nose and squeezes it*
That is like, a mating call in the furry fandom. Careful, you don't want to commit adultery. :V
 
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ellaerna

Guest
I know Scripture is infallible because it is the power of God unto salvation to those who believe in its testimony. I know it is infallible because it is the fulfillment of prophecy and is true in every word.

www.reformed.org: Westminster Confession of Faith

Saying that is like saying "I'm hot cause I'm fly." It means nothing. I acknowledge your faith, but it's not an argument. You literally don't know that it's true. You just believe.

But if you want to get technical, how is it infallible when the bible itself is contradictory? You don't even have to go that far to recognize it. Genesis 1.1-2.3 and Genesis 2.4 can't even agree on how and in what order the creation happened.

Not to mention all of the many years of science that refutes it.
 

Saiko

GTWT Survivor
Once again, asking "why" is necessary. Why do you feel this way? Why do you think this is true? I'll gladly hear you out, but saying that something's true just because it is true isn't a valid argument. Remember, 500 years ago or so, most Christians believed that the earth was flat and that the earth was the center of the universe. They thought that concept was infallible.
I know Scripture is infallible because it is the power of God unto salvation to those who believe in its testimony. I know it is infallible because it is the fulfillment of prophecy and is true in every word.

Uhhhh something you both should realize is that it’s okay to just revert back to “I have faith that it’s infallible.” If that’s a fundamental premise of the religion, then there isn’t much to discuss there.

However, Felix, it’s equally important that you treat it like a fundamental premise if that’s what it is. That means it is a prerequisite to your belief system that cannot be derived without begging the question, which is the error you just made. (You said you know it is infallible because everything in it is true.)
 
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AshtheDragon

Guest
Once again, asking "why" is necessary. Why do you feel this way? Why do you think this is true? I'll gladly hear you out, but saying that something's true just because it is true isn't a valid argument. Remember, 500 years ago or so, most Christians believed that the earth was flat and that the earth was the center of the universe. They thought that concept was infallible.

I would say the flat Earth thing was long disproved by the Chinese and the Egyptians and even the first century Greeks (the latter being a contemporary people to Jesus and the apostles). When it comes to Europeans though, in the last five hundred years you have to factor in the fall of Rome and the Dark Ages (and especially the bubonic plague) where there was a severe regression in and hatred of such knowledge furthered by Anglicans and the Roman Catholic church. Like the fig leaf over genitalia thing? Yeah, them.

I believe Jesus is real for the faith imparted to me.

Furthermore, and it's not at all a huge factor supporting my belief, there is also secular historical evidence recorded and reported by Romans describing worldwide/empire wide phenomena immediately after His death.
 
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jtrekkie

Feathered
The flat earth thing is a myth, it was not a common conception in the middle ages. Geocentricism was supported by the Catholic church because it was the prevailing view among scientists at the time, and while it's easy to make fun of them now geocentricism is not an unreasonable view. In fact, the first theoretical descriptions of heleocetricism appealed to aesthetics only, evidence supporting them was only found much later after the search for stellar parralax failed (see Bradley, stellar aberration.)

You might be interested to know that the Bible wasn't always held to be infallible (by early Catholics anyway). That came about as a product of it being inspired, and that came about as a product of unusual accuracy. In short, the world is less ridiculous if it's true.
 
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Scales42

Guest
What an interesting Thread. Let me tell you a little story.....

Back in the day, my mother wanted me to be baptized, but i fought against it. Even as a child I never wanted
to commit myself to a religion, that being said, I did believe in god and even prayed from time to time. but then real life kicked
in and I witnessed horrible things happening to me and people that I cared about. This is usually the part where the person
"finds god" and everything turns out good at the end, that didnt happen though. After recovering from a messed up illness
I have come to the conclusion that there is only one being out there that can control my faith ----------------> ME
My morals are my creation, my faith is for me, I dont need a god for that. Maybe there is a god, but
he/she/it is probably working on a more interesting project now... Anyway, good luck trying to convert a few sinful furfags ;)

Have a great day yall :D
 
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AshtheDragon

Guest
I know... But, I'm still disgusted on a visceral level that there are people here who think I should change because I'm into men while being physically male and for enjoying yiff and liking the kinky stuff. "Accepting" somebody doesn't just mean not harassing them or actively trying to get them to change, but it's also believing that they aren't inherently wrong for X, Y or Z. Even if somebody treats me nicely, they can't really respect me as an equal person if they think a fundamental part of who I am MUST be changed.

It's more than treating someone nicely.

I treat you with respect because you are human, just like me.

We don't agree on some things, but that doesn't mean I think you are worthy of persecution, or death, or imprisonment, or shunning perpetrated by other people, by "Christians" because of your sexual orientation. Same with my fellow Christians. I've had enough of that behavior as a black person being harassed and hated, being called a "n-gger". In fact, I'd rather have friends that are different from me to hear their perspective. I have in the past. I have friends at college I deeply respected and cared about who are of a different sexual orientations. We ate together, socialized... I in no way ridiculed them or their faiths.

Jesus associated and continues to associate with "sinners"- what we all are. Me, you, everyone, because no human save for Him is perfect... I for one, do too! I am no better than you intrinsically.

I cared and still care about them even though I am concerned for their welfare after death. In fact, I care even more given I was baptized late last year after what may be my final stint at college. I asked one of them if she still cares about me even after my conversion and my diametrically opposed statement(s) of faith and she said yes. I think that's wonderful, personally. That our bond is so strong it transcends our differences.

What is it secularists always reply, "Only God can judge"? Well let Him do so after death or at the Judgement.

I can judge if a behavior is wrong based on the Word of God recorded in the bible and react accordingly within myself, say my statement of faith to others... but I can't condemn you to death or Hell because it's simply not my place to do so. I can't say "God hates f-gs", "God hates you on every level" because that's simply not true. I don't know the future, I don't know God's ultimate plan for your life and how you will react to Him in the future, and what's more: I know how much God cares for humanity.

* * *

Aside: did you draw your avatar?
 
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PaintedMica

Active Member
Now, this is just my opinion so please, don't think I'm bashing or forcing my ideas and ideals on anyone. In my view of things, a religion which prevents one from loving another human regardless of gender in an intimate fashion, is a religion whose doctrine cares not for the needs of its people. Now, I'm a pagan, so my view on religion is different from most, as is my take on using a god, or gods as a crutch.

The Aesir have never stated that one can not love people of the same sex, nor has he stated that we are born flawed, and filled with sin. A religion that propagates the idea of original sin and chronic repentance for every minor perceived slight against a god is in my eyes, harmful. Mentally and spiritually, for if you degrade yourself in your own eyes as a way of coming to terms with how you appear to your god, you have simply accepted self-degradation which constitutes a weaker soul.

In general, I stepped away from Christ because I was tired of destroying my self worth in order to be "Truthful" to him and myself. Now since this is about the Fandom and sexuality, I'll loop back around to that. Sexuality in my eyes is a basic part of human biology, be it homosexual or heterosexual. The fandom does have a sexual side, yes, as the fandom is run by humans. (I think)

Therefore in my eyes, the sexual side of the fandom is an expression of human sexuality and art. Which to me is a height of beauty I had not witnessed before joining the Fandom. I do not see the problem with it, as my gods do not preach against sexuality, nor do they ask for me to beg them for forgiveness. They simply ask that I conduct myself with honor and responsibility, and should I do wrong, to right that wrong through my own strength.

Just my two cents on the matter...well, more like five in this case. I apologize if this is horrifically off topic heh..
 
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