Humanity and Age Regression

[Rilvor]

Eh. This human body I have kind of sucks. I don't think I'd want to keep it forever. I'd much rather go with the whole cybernetic thing than an age-regression treatment.
So far as the effect on humanity in general, if it was invented before we managed to terraform other planets to allow humanity to expand infinitely into the cosmos, it would probably end in complete and utter misery and chaos for the whole planet. We're stressing this place at 6 billion people; imagine it at 10 billion. Plus, with everyone but accident and murder victims living to 300 years, what happens to retirement? Either people work forever, or we end up with a society that's 98% golf players and vacationers.
So it's probably not a good idea... but everyone would want it anyway. We can only hope that it takes a long time for this to get invented.

I think humanity will be in utter chaos for some time before we work ourselves out. There will be a revolution as the world is turned upside down on its head, but how that comes out no one can know.

Why wouldn't it be? The fountain of youth is in extremely high demand. It could be a very simple procedure but if the procedure can effectively be hidden from the public and therefore be difficult if not impossible to reproduce outside of XYZ Laboratories' top secret facilities they can charge whatever they like for it and people will trample each other in their rush to give XYZ their money for the gift of eternal youth. Your rebuttal assumes that whoever discovers this wonderful thing is going to be of a mind to let people have it for a reasonable price. The fact that XYZ was researching the fountain of youth at all means that very likely someone (XYZ itself, likely) was paying for that research and intends to collect on their investment.

Just like every other breakthrough for humanity in history through medicine and science has been greedily held from the masses, right?

Right?

Nevermind what happens to Uncle Moneybags if it ever gets out that he's keeping millions of people who fear death from a greater existence.



Also, here's an idea for population control:

All criminals who have been convicted to life or death sentences are given the treatment and shipped out as explorers of the cosmos for us. They're effectively gone forever, but still of some use to humanity.

But yes to mirror earlier, I think people actually having kids may not be as big of a deal as people think it would be.

 

[Kyrodo]

It's not as if it would abolish other forms of death. One can still succumb to disease, or be blown to smitherings by a 155 mm howitzer shell. Also, perhaps in the future, Earth will not be our only option as far as living arrangements.

 

[TreacleFox]

We could make it so that the birth rate drops massively by not allowing people to reproduce untill they are 200 years old or something, by which time death from other causes had kill atleast 1 other person. It would be very hard to police though.

 

[Seas]

Maybe people would be given a choice of either being cured of aging, or being able to have a kid. This way people wouldn't be denied of this joy (for those who find it joyous, i.e. not me :V ) but it comes at a relative cost.

Anyway, I'd take the treatment wihout hesitation. Of course only after making sure there are no ill side-effects, or shady terms in the small font.
I think I'd never be bored of all the possibilities avaiable when exploring space, and things you can do on planets(/any kind of colony), even this one would keep be entertained for a very long time.

About the Pennybags issue: Capitalism won't last forever, just like every single system humanity has come up with so far in history, so the difference betwewen rich and poor won't be an issue forever, in the pricing/avaiability of the treatment for example. (Maybe other issues could arise with the new system though, nothing is perfect.)

Also, to some prevois comments about brain capacity: The brain can't contain infinite information. Nor does it lose it's ability to store new ones when it gets "full". It overwrites the information least accessed, meaning te least useful ones, probably being the older memories and less used learnings. It will always store information that is neccesary in your present, just like now.

 

[Kyrodo]

Maybe people would be given a choice of either being cured of aging, or being able to have a kid. This way people wouldn't be denied of this joy (for those who find it joyous, i.e. not me :V ) but it comes at a relative cost.

Anyway, I'd take the treatment wihout hesitation. Of course only after making sure there are no ill side-effects, or shady terms in the small font.
I think I'd never be bored of all the possibilities avaiable when exploring space, and things you can do on planets(/any kind of colony), even this one would keep be entertained for a very long time.

About the Pennybags issue: Capitalism won't last forever, just like every single system humanity has come up with so far in history, so the difference betwewen rich and poor won't be an issue forever, in the pricing/avaiability of the treatment for example. (Maybe other issues could arise with the new system though, nothing is perfect.)

Also, to some prevois comments about brain capacity: The brain can't contain infinite information. Nor does it lose it's ability to store new ones when it gets "full". It overwrites the information least accessed, meaning te least useful ones, probably being the older memories and less used learnings. It will always store information that is neccesary in your present, just like now.

You seem to be referring to long term memory at first... then you seem to be referring to short term memory, which is completely different.

There was a third even more temporary piece of memory, but I forget what that is. I think it's what filters your senses to whatever you're paying attention too. Anyway yes, even long term memory is presumably not infinite, but it is vast, and no one has ever filled that capacity so far with our current life expectancies.

 

[Gavrill]

No one has ever lived long enough and kept mental health intact enough to prove there is a limit. Yet.

However, we can see the limits in our daily processing. How many places have you lived? Do you remember every address, phone number, and exactly where you put your car keys in each place?

Obviously if our focus was on this, rather than everything our brains consider "more important", then we might remember it all. But unless we're sacrificing more room to this information, it's not going to come back easily. Only savants seem to remember things like that. And most savants remember a lot in one area, but are completely lost on other areas (for example, the ability to communicate normally with other human beings).

However, brain matter is constantly shedding and being replaced with new matter, as is every cell in the body. By reversing this process, you're simply holding onto old information (possibly) and not storing new.
But if we had prosthetic memory cells, or a completely mechanical brain, the "data" of memories might be stored much easier than by a faulty human brain that is constantly learning and repressing to stay afloat.

Cracked ran an article about immortality once that mentioned how time degenerates memories, like you know how the older you get, how the stressful or even awesome situations you had when you were younger just kind of vanish? You could possibly bring them up with a reminder, but imagine that you're alive for hundreds of years. A five-year marriage will seem like the blink of an eye to someone who's lived that long.

Just some random rambling thoughts.

 

[Rilvor]

constantly shedding and being replaced with new matter, as is every cell in the body. By reversing this process, you're simply holding onto old information (possibly) and not storing new.

I personally think that very unlikely. The brain is not a machine, it does not rewind. If there was scientific proof of that, it would be interesting to read no doubt.

Like I said earlier in the thread.

If you're going to live 500 years, you're going to have to learn to live with yourself.

 

[Seas]

You seem to be referring to long term memory at first... then you seem to be referring to short term memory, which is completely different.

What I meant with information useful to you now, is the ones that your brain should have in storage right now, for example a telephone number you often use. Therefore useful to have easily accessible.

 

[CannonFodder]

We could make it so that the birth rate drops massively by not allowing people to reproduce untill they are 200 years old or something, by which time death from other causes had kill atleast 1 other person. It would be very hard to police though.

You know how many groups would reproduce anyhow as a means of gaining the majority eventually?
Not to drag religion into it, but if catholics kept the "no condoms" thing in a good two or three hundred years of not following that they'd control the world.

 

[Gavrill]

I personally think that very unlikely. The brain is not a machine, it does not rewind. If there was scientific proof of that, it would be interesting to read no doubt.

Like I said earlier in the thread.

If you're going to live 500 years, you're going to have to learn to live with yourself.

What I mean is not having the ability to shed old cells. I don't know if the cells themselves hold memory, but if you're unable to form new ones, I'm not sure what the result would be.

 

[TechnoGypsy]

RIGHT, NOW THAT I'M THINKING PROPERLY AGAIN
When someone passes away, the cause of death is noted on the death certificate. IN NO CIRCUMSTANCE can the cause of death be 'Old Age'. There is virtually no way that old age can kill you. What DOES kill you are diseases, vital organs failing, cancer, etc. Those are the causes of death, not just because the body had had enough.

With this in mind, it is very possible to live forever if you do the following:
-Don't smoke
-Eat the right stuff
-Avoid diseases (Which is near impossible but if you seal off a house and pump in pure nitrogen/oxygen whatever atmospheric gasses then good for you)
-The the exact amount of exercise needed
-Keep your mind sharp
-Nourish your spiritual side
-Take care of your skeletal system (postures and whatnot)

I have a more detailed analysis of this on the other computer, but it's off now and I'm too bothered and slightly hyperactive from too much choc rocks and bubble gum to stop typing. Basically a whole lot of this was found out from my Aunt, who is a GP in NZ.
Stating all that, it is very possible to live forever since no part of you will fail because it isn't brought down by anything. And when it isn't so terribly hard to do so then there's the whole dilemma about birth rates and overpopulation to worry about.

 

[Gavrill]

Don't forget that breathing oxygen wears down your lungs.

 

[Rilvor]

What I mean is not having the ability to shed old cells. I don't know if the cells themselves hold memory, but if you're unable to form new ones, I'm not sure what the result would be.

The idea is that after regression removes the effects of aging, your brain will immediately begin creating new cells like a young healthy brain should.

RIGHT, NOW THAT I'M THINKING PROPERLY AGAIN
When someone passes away, the cause of death is noted on the death certificate. IN NO CIRCUMSTANCE can the cause of death be 'Old Age'. There is virtually no way that old age can kill you. What DOES kill you are diseases, vital organs failing, cancer, etc. Those are the causes of death, not just because the body had had enough.

With this in mind, it is very possible to live forever if you do the following:
-Don't smoke
-Eat the right stuff
-Avoid diseases (Which is near impossible but if you seal off a house and pump in pure nitrogen/oxygen whatever atmospheric gasses then good for you)
-The the exact amount of exercise needed
-Keep your mind sharp
-Nourish your spiritual side
-Take care of your skeletal system (postures and whatnot)

I have a more detailed analysis of this on the other computer, but it's off now and I'm too bothered and slightly hyperactive from too much choc rocks and bubble gum to stop typing. Basically a whole lot of this was found out from my Aunt, who is a GP in NZ.
Stating all that, it is very possible to live forever since no part of you will fail because it isn't brought down by anything. And when it isn't so terribly hard to do so then there's the whole dilemma about birth rates and overpopulation to worry about.

I am too tired to respond to this in the manner it deserves.

 

[Gavrill]

The idea is that after regression removes the effects of aging, your brain will immediately begin creating new cells like a young healthy brain should.

Ahhh. I get cha.

So essentially it would be the same as "rebooting" your health? Going back to a state of a healthy body and mind?

 

[Rilvor]

Ahhh. I get cha.

So essentially it would be the same as "rebooting" your health? Going back to a state of a healthy body and mind?

Exactly. Think of it as a tune-up for your car. You get yourself checked out, a bit of maintenance, and perhaps a small replacement/repair or two. Not gutting the car and sticking in new parts to leave just the outer shell left.

 

[TechnoGypsy]

Don't forget that breathing oxygen wears down your lungs.

Problem solved, I place you into a chamber and increase the pressure to I-don't-know-what, then your body absorbs the oxygen rather than needing the respiratory system.
I do believe that that procedure is used for people who have been breathing carbon monoxide and their blood cannot carry enough oxygen. But it is expensive and not a long term immortality solution.

 

[Gavrill]

Exactly. Think of it as a tune-up for your car. You get yourself checked out, a bit of maintenance, and perhaps a small replacement/repair or two. Not gutting the car and sticking in new parts to leave just the outer shell left.

Oh, in that case my longpost about memory is pretty much null. Whoops. x3

Problem solved, I place you into a chamber and increase the pressure to I-don't-know-what, then your body absorbs the oxygen rather than needing the respiratory system.
I do believe that that procedure is used for people who have been breathing carbon monoxide and their blood cannot carry enough oxygen. But it is expensive and not a long term immortality solution.

Uhhhh
Um.

Pressurized oxygen tanks are for people suffering with the bends, which is essentially air bubbles forming in the blood. Carbon monoxide victims get put on pure oxygen masks with no pressure involved.

No, humans cannot live forever. (With current medicines and treatment.)

 

[BRN]

The elimination of "survival of the fittest", anywhere, at any time, would be devastating to the universe entire. Natural law cannot easily be contravened.

Overpopulation is one obvious problem - the world can only support about nine billion people [citation]- but that aside, the problems that would arise from any one individual with resource being given the time to establish themselves deep enough into capitalism and society to the point of "linchpin" status (much like major banks are the linchpins of the world economy) are undeniable.

Imagine the problems that would arise if it became neccessary for the sake of the rest of the world, that one particularly powerful person should continue to survive.

Not to mention the points raised in Deus Ex: Human Revolution about human augmentation being considered progress by some, but actually being a way in which those people who consider the ethics and decline the augmentation are actually being left behind. 'Progress' is relative.

However, it's undeniable that a particularly powerful individual being given the resources to live for an excessively long time can be an extremely beneficial thing for the rest of mankind - consider Nemoto, from Manifold:Space by Stephen Baxter, who extended her life by many centuries after the discovery of extraterrestial intelligence, and was able to use her millenia of memory aswell as her own lifespan to 'save the world', so to speak.

The applications of extending one human's lifespan are incredible from a scientific and spiritual perspective; particularly intelligent scientists would be able to bring much more than a standard lifespan of progress to the world, and artists and musicians could compose art for so much longer.

There's also, however, the question of ethical response... there are always some who disagree, and may take their disagreement to an extreme level. A new wing of terrorism, puritans who would believe themselves to be fighting for the betterment of mankind.

Government's natural response would be to regulate the technology; or, worse, to tax it. It would have to. Yet, the only ethical application of the technology would be to make it free to all, for free, exactly without that regulation or cost.

The question of immortality is an ethical nightmare.

 

[Rilvor]

The elimination of "survival of the fittest", anywhere, at any time, would be devastating to the universe entire. Natural law cannot easily be contravened.

Overpopulation is one obvious problem - the world can only support about nine billion people [citation]- but that aside, the problems that would arise from any one individual with resource being given the time to establish themselves deep enough into capitalism and society to the point of "linchpin" status (much like major banks are the linchpins of the world economy) are undeniable.

Imagine the problems that would arise if it became neccessary for the sake of the rest of the world, that one particularly powerful person should continue to survive.

Not to mention the points raised in Deus Ex: Human Revolution about human augmentation being considered progress by some, but actually being a way in which those people who consider the ethics and decline the augmentation are actually being left behind. 'Progress' is relative.

However, it's undeniable that a particularly powerful individual being given the resources to live for an excessively long time can be an extremely beneficial thing for the rest of mankind - consider Nemoto, from Manifold:Space by Stephen Baxter, who extended her life by many centuries after the discovery of extraterrestial intelligence, and was able to use her millenia of memory aswell as her own lifespan to 'save the world', so to speak.

The applications of extending one human's lifespan are incredible from a scientific and spiritual perspective; particularly intelligent scientists would be able to bring much more than a standard lifespan of progress to the world, and artists and musicians could compose art for so much longer.

There's also, however, the question of ethical response... there are always some who disagree, and may take their disagreement to an extreme level. A new wing of terrorism, puritans who would believe themselves to be fighting for the betterment of mankind.

Government's natural response would be to regulate the technology; or, worse, to tax it. It would have to. Yet, the only ethical application of the technology would be to make it free to all, for free, exactly without that regulation or cost.

The question of immortality is an ethical nightmare.

But one that we will eventually have to answer.

I hope for people to think about those future answers, and to think about them in ways that don't revolve around "There will be a new evil overlord just like X!"

 

[BRN]

But one that we will eventually have to answer.

I don't mean to be cynical, but I consider questions such as immortality to be entirely hypothetical, considering the unstable state of things in the world.

 

[Dj_whoohoo]

This I believe is not much of a bad idea, especially for the very wealthy. They would be able to make themselves young again and again forever still making money. I would accept it if the treatment were to "wear off" . What I mean by that is after I dunno maybe 50 years you will then start to grow older. Like if you were frozen in capsule for 50 years, then when you get out you start to age again normally.

It would be great for those who would want to do every thing in the world. But then what's left? , after doing everything you lose track of time and think " been there , been back". If NASA doesn't revitalizes the space flight program and begin recolonizing mars you be literally bored to death. That if you do every thing earth has to offer.

And how long will it last? 1 year or a 100 ?.
Soon you be thinking suicidal thoughts , but then again if you do live forever With your friends it will be one he'll of a ride

 

[VoidBat]

No, I wouldn't accept the treatment.
In the end we're all born to die, and if age doesn't kill you there's tons of other things that will take care of that job. Wars, natural disasters, pandemics and accidents, to mention a few examples. There is no "safe bet" to outwit death, and even if there was or will be, some consideration should be required. Are we really that desperate, or scared of the unknown? Is it our ignorance about having troubles to accept that all things must have an end? Or perhaps this wish is fueled by our selfish desires? Not to mention, would this miracle cure be readily available for every Average Joe/Mary? Or would it just be a privilege to use for those with the right, economical assets?

As for the future, in this scenario, I can agree on that there will be a great chasm forming between those who are for it, and against it.

 

[Moonfall The Fox]

I'd do it, but probably maintain my body at around the age of 30 for a while. I don't desire to go through the process of aging at all, and I already have become nervous and paranoid about how few years i have left before becoming old. I don't care if I die. I just don't want to age.

 

[Uro]

Hell yea I'd do it, why not?
There's nothing glorious about aging. Especially when the long term result is typically some type of terrible disease or eventually forgetting everything in your life that matters to you.

The primary issue I could see developing is an abundance of people populating the earth. However in contrast to that I'm sure it would be quite expensive and only the elite few would be able to bank such a thing. Would probably have to be higher upper class to afford such a thing reasonably.

 

[Leafblower29]

No holy shit I plan to die by 30.