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i'm not sure i comprehend mourning.

foxmusk

uh oh stinky
Yesterday, there was a murder suicide in the county where i live. a man killed his wife for divorcing him, then killed himself. as of today, it's all over the news. i was invited to join a group on facebook to pray for the family, but i don't pray so i left it in limbo and didn't accept or deny. i feel like that's very wrong of me to join a group when i don't really pray, and i'm just joining because others are. trying to convince myself to join, i checked the page.

it's all prayers. people writing messages to god asking him to take care of the family, and no one will tell what happened on the page. people are asking but the group creator and others are snapping that it's rude to ask what happened. i don't understand why people can't talk about an incident after it happened. i don't see anything disrespectful about wanting to know why you were asked to pray for someone. i can't imagine praying and not understanding why you were.

this isn't a rant or a rave, but more just thoughts out loud. i don't understand mourning. i don't understand why we as animals grieve. i don't understand why we react to sadness with more sadness, and encourage more sadness out of that. it seems so odd a concept. i've never really...grieved anything. i was upset when my first ferret died, and that was because i felt alone. i didn't have many friends then. i can understand sadness through loneliness, but i don't understand funerals, wakes, memorials and so on. why do we gather people together to encourage them to be sad over a death? i've never grieved for the sake of grieving, and i don't quite comprehend the idea.

i know that probably sounds pretty odd that i'm asking questions about basic human emotion, but it's one i've never felt. i take loss with laughter. remember the good times i had with someone, not take time to be sad for them being gone. i don't like the idea of gathering to encourage humble sadness.

this is not meant to be a slam on mourning or human emotion. i'm not trying to start conflict, just more thinking. why do you think we encouraging mourning or grieving over a loss?
 

Eske

Don't believe the mask...
I have trouble feeling sad about death, as well. It bothers me, sometimes -- I'm afraid that I'm some kind of sociopath. Sometimes I try to force myself to be sad, just for the sake of being sad and not looking like an unfeeling bitch, but typically I'm just completely apathetic to death. I've had pets die, friends die.. I was never sad. It was just like finishing the last page of a long book. It's over, and that's that. I might feel sad if there was something I never got to tell them, but I don't think that's grieving.

It's really odd, because I'm a highly emotional person, otherwise. So basically, I have no idea. (This seems to be a recurring trend with me, lately.)
 

Koronikov

New Member
Whenever someone close to me dies the first thing i feel is loss, and then I am made to go to a funeral where everyone cries for the loss. I never understood funerals, I always wonder to myself why are these people just making themselves feel worse, why are they not celebrating the life this person lived , the things they did. Im guessing im in the same boat as you...
 

LLiz

Use your flippers to get down!
Mate, I come from an Italian family, while someone's alive they're at each others throats, when someone dies those same people all put on such a horrible mourning dramatic act, annoys the hell out of me, stop putting on a show idiots!

Fake mourning really does give me the shits.

When someone close to you who impacts on your life in a big way dies its totally natural to miss that person. That doesn't always mean that you need to break down in tears and not be able to leave your house for days. It could be a feeling of emptiness, it might even be a simple change you make in your life, for example, you might continue to avoid a restaurant that a deceased person hated. You might also donate more to a charity that aims to cure a disease that person died of.

Mourning isn't just all tears and total sorrow and I'd argue that more subtle changes due someones absence has to another persons life, the more validation that person has. As does remembering that person for years to come, but still getting on with life in the mean time.

Regarding that Facebook thing, I never accept anything like that, yeah it does sadden me to hear of an incident like that, but I don't understand what joining a Facebook group will do to solve the issue. I think stopping and about the tragedy and actually feeling sorry for the people involved has more meaning then mindlessly clicking a join button.
 

Aden

Play from your ****ing HEART
I'm in an odd position with this.

When someone dies that I enjoyed being around, I feel sad that they will never be there again. It's that feeling that there's a hole there that you thought you'd never have to fill. But at the same time, I kind of think it's selfish to hang up everything to grieve. The person will never be there again, and that's a fact of life, so isn't dwelling over how it affects my life from now on a version of self-pity? Shouldn't we be remembering the good times we had and being thankful that we could have those times in the first place?

But then I bounce back and each time I feel a little more this way. I guess you could say I've gained perspective after having a few relatives die. In the future when it happens I will still indeed be sad, but hopefully I'll be able to see their passing through in a more fond manner.

\But if my boyfriend dies young for whatever reason, that's it. Game over. Might as well say my goodbyes to everyone right then because I ain't bouncing back from that one.
 

Gavrill

ladies~
I usually don't care about people dying, at all. That sounds pretty bad I guess, but because my grandfather is a pastor, I was always dragged to the funerals of people I didn't know. Eventually, I just stopped caring. Now, I am pretty much apathetic towards death because my grandparents always had such a casual view of it.
"Oh, so-n-so died yesterday."
Me: "I'm not going to the funeral."
"But I thought they were your friend."
Me: "I. Don't. Care."

Or maybe I just avoid being around depressing religious ceremonies.

Like funerals and/or weddings.
 

Shico

Member
When some one dies of old age or illness...I feel bad because people think I am cold hearted...but a natural death when you know it's comming...just does not beother me much at all :/
My granddad was 97 when he died and was not doing so good in the last few months of life, so....I was not exactly sad.

But when our 4 year old dog died I was pretty upset because she could have had another good 7-10 yeasr with us easily and her death was sudden and tragic :(
 
I am not a person to be high on deathes.
It happens here as well, murders suicides, what not!
It's not only that I don't care, it's that...
Praying. Who can I pray to? God? There is no god in my belief, so there is no reason to pray for something that doesn't exist in my mind.
How about the sorrow? Nope, I don't want to get into the sorrow of a funeral because I won't get out of it. It will just ruin my day.

How about weddings? Nope.. I don't want to even remember weddings, as it reminds me of the Versai tragedy.
It's a tragedy where there was a wedding, people danced and the floor literally fell three levels and crushed people one after another. Hundreds died.
If you want to watch it, it's here. Seems like Mr. Cameraman survived.
 

Markov

Such is life in Mother Russia
Anyone who says they do not feel sadness and grief when a loved one dies has never really had a loved one die.

Simply because there is no obvious reason to feel such a way does not mean it isn't the healthy way to behave. As a human, you are not a logical being. Humans as a species are very emotional creatures, and it is what drives us to create, destroy, and everything in between.

Perhaps though, if you do not understand why a human does something you do not understand, you should ask yourself why a human does anything.
 
^
That is horrible...and that video is gonna huant my dreams tonight damnit >.<
It haunted many people.

The person who built the building is at fault, as he used a lightweight ceiling that couldn't handle that number of people at all.
He was sent to jail, and the father of one of the married couple was interviewed.
 
I can hardly bother to feel any emotions myself, when close friends/family pass away. I dunno why. I'm just like that.
But there's no way I expect anyone to be able to feel true grief when "offered" (asked?) to pray for people they hardly know.
Yeah, you can feel bad about that. And some sad stories did make me teary-eyed, although not one moment did I consider grief for anyone but the living.
So it's possible to feel bad for these people. You can feel the need to help them. But is that truly grief?
Anyone who says they do not feel sadness and grief when a loved one dies has never really had a loved one die.

Simply because there is no obvious reason to feel such a way does not mean it isn't the healthy way to behave. As a human, you are not a logical being. Humans as a species are very emotional creatures, and it is what drives us to create, destroy, and everything in between.

Perhaps though, if you do not understand why a human does something you do not understand, you should ask yourself why a human does anything.
Can be true, although I find that's only a play of words.
You can care for someone and not give a shit when they die, I guess.


I usually don't care about people dying, at all. That sounds pretty bad I guess, but because my grandfather is a pastor, I was always dragged to the funerals of people I didn't know. Eventually, I just stopped caring. Now, I am pretty much apathetic towards death because my grandparents always had such a casual view of it.
"Oh, so-n-so died yesterday."
Me: "I'm not going to the funeral."
"But I thought they were your friend."
Me: "I. Don't. Care."

Or maybe I just avoid being around depressing religious ceremonies.

Like funerals and/or weddings.
Ack, loooots of old people are like that.
I wonder if they're trying to banalize death in order to forget their own incoming demise.
 
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RedFoxTwo

Sarcastic Lurker
Anyone who says they do not feel sadness and grief when a loved one dies has never really had a loved one die.

Simply because there is no obvious reason to feel such a way does not mean it isn't the healthy way to behave. As a human, you are not a logical being. Humans as a species are very emotional creatures, and it is what drives us to create, destroy, and everything in between.

Perhaps though, if you do not understand why a human does something you do not understand, you should ask yourself why a human does anything.

I remember the glorious day when I woke up to the fact that there was no meaning in life. I knew that there was nothing after death, and that is all the incentive I need. I know that anything I do only matters in MY lifetime, because I am the devolved superpower that is my brain. Most people are perfectly genetically logical, they're their genes' bitch, and so they are very emotional and care deeply about the welfare of any potential children, friends and family after said person's death. After all, emotions are the genetic expression that influences our mind to act, and as genes are most interested in their survival, it would obviously make us care deeply about people around us.

I can see so clearly that as a now independent mind, my goals in life should be the following:

1. Bitchin' amounts of fun.
2. Plenty of delicious stimulation in the pleasure centres.

And that is exactly what I plan to do!
 

Jw

PINEAPPLE ACCOMPLISHED
Deaths'a funny emotion. For those that ever said that a death doesn't make them feel anything obviously didn't have to participate as a pallbearer for the funeral, or stand up to give a speech, or anything that you arrange for the family of the dead person.

"Sadness" isn't the best term for it. It's a terrible sense of loss if you lose someone you truly love. Loss of the difference that person made in your life. Loss in the sense that you won't see them at their house anymore.

Then there's other feelings. Injustice for a friend being killed for no apparent reason. Maybe anger at yourself or another person for whatever happened. or maybe there's a state of shock or denial most people never get past when they don't know someone. Heck, if you don't remember them, how can you realize they are dead? Not easily.

However, I don't think sadness is always connected with death. I don't remember my dead relatives because of their funerals, but rather their lives and the funny moments I remember. In life, there's two times when you can be hysterical-- when you laugh or cry. It's kinda philosophical, but can you explain why you laugh at something. Sure, it's because something's funny, but what's the reason why you make that sound when something is funny? The truth is, you laugh and cry when words fail you-- you can't always put things , feeling or actions into words, they are sometimes just experienced. And the weird part is, your strongest memories are usually always moments when you can laugh or when you can cry for whatever reason.

When the time comes for me to die, I hope there's not a lot of blubbering people around because of some individual like me. I hope, if anything, that they're laughing at all the stuff I did for laughs or remembering the good I did in the world.

tl;dr So in a sense, I'm agreeing and disagreeing with you. Crying may be a natural action associated with death. However, I hope people remember me in laughter.
 
Everybody earns a shock when a closed one dies.
When you see people die in front of your face like in the Versai tragedy, you feel sorrow, and you are shocked.
Hearing about the death of a not familliar person, is nothing compared to seeing it.
Not to mention feeling death.

I never had somebody close to me die. Though, I still see death peeks from every corner.
And tomorrow it will also peek.
 

foxmusk

uh oh stinky
Anyone who says they do not feel sadness and grief when a loved one dies has never really had a loved one die.

Simply because there is no obvious reason to feel such a way does not mean it isn't the healthy way to behave. As a human, you are not a logical being. Humans as a species are very emotional creatures, and it is what drives us to create, destroy, and everything in between.

Perhaps though, if you do not understand why a human does something you do not understand, you should ask yourself why a human does anything.

that isn't true. i know very well that i've loved several that have died. but, it's just hard for me to feel sad for them. they're not suffering anymore, so why should i?

i don't believe in expressing emotions so exuberantly like other people do. i don't cry. and i very rarely yell. i don't see any gain from voicing how i feel to others in any way other than just saying it. why do i need to cry just so other people know i'm sad? that seems so unnecessary.
 

Eske

Don't believe the mask...
Perhaps though, if you do not understand why a human does something you do not understand, you should ask yourself why a human does anything.


I do ask myself this. For the most part, everything comes down to instinct -- and grieving is no exception. What I want to know is what benefit grieving has. As far as I can tell, the only positive side effect is social bonding of the surviving members of society -- but you don't need to cry and mourn over a death to bond, you could just as well bond over the good memories and celebrate the person's life rather than putting everything on pause to make yourself and everyone else a miserable wreck.

Another idea I had seems rather selfishly inclined at first glance -- and that's being reminded of one's own mortality. This is the strongest thing I feel, when faced with death -- the idea that my days are numbered, and one day it will all be over. It's overwhelming, sometimes -- it's scary. And maybe that's part of what fuels such intense emotion?
 

lilEmber

Small Dragon
Most do it for show, thinking it's bonus points with some man upstairs.
Some do it because they truly feel sorry, upset, or wish to pay condolences.
The rest don't care and just go along with it or sit silently.

There's outliers that troll, too, but really they just don't care and want to rile up people that do.
 

Vo

Member
Most of these posts hint at but don't quite outright say that grieving is always for your own loss. Having never experienced death, those of us left alive aren't upset because someone died per se, but because they'll no longer be in our lives where we enjoyed them (barring possible empathy for a horrid death etc., you know what I mean). Nearly everyone needs to sort out and often express the torrent of emotions resulting from a (possibly sudden) loss, which explains all the introspection and crying. Ritual is also a common need, which explains getting together to express grief and wistfulness, and send the dead off ceremoniously. It's for the survivors, not the dead.

As far as I've seen, no one (in the Western world) gathers to encourage sadness. The attitude at most funerals or memorials is to recognize that it is often sad to lose someone, but this isn't dwelt on. Most of it is reflection on the enjoyable memories, talk about what kind of person the deceased was, what they wish they could have done with them, etc.

The reason why we encourage mourning? If you mean the structure of mourning in general, the funerals etc., we can probably chalk it up to, again, the human need for ritual. It may seem like I'm restating this but what I mean is that we fulfill this need both by the funeral itself, and by the expectation that when someone dies we will hold one.

Of course a sense of loss isn't solely responsible for upset reactions to death. Shock, sense of mortality (as said somewhere up there), loneliness, etc.
 

Eske

Don't believe the mask...
Jack, you have a good point. That was a very well-written post.

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding what you intended to say; but what if, as quite a few responders have pointed out, there are no torrents of emotions? Is this just a matter of blocking out emotion because you don't want to deal with it (i.e., it is there, but put in the back of the mind)? Or can it be that some people simply accept death, and others cannot? What is it that causes some people to completely break down at the mere mention of death, and others to feel completely apathetic to it?
 

3picFox

An hero...
Like you felt lonely when you lost your ferret, other people might feel the same loneliness when they lose a loved one or friend. Someone with a lot of friends can lose one person and still feel lonely.
 
It's sad to lose somebody, but when it's dead, then it's dead.
There is nothing to do.
Praying or being sad about it doesn't help nobody.
And it doesn't make you feel better.

That's why you forget and live on.
People who live in the sorrowful death of others will die as well, very soon.
 

Jude

U1 S7 P106
I freaking bawl if I know the person somewhat or at least talk to them.

Otherwise, I'm not really phased by it.
 

8-bit

Member
I don't give a damn. Why would they care if I give a shit or not? They're dead. I'm guess I'm a sociopath? :/

I also LOL on the inside whenever people commit suicide.
 

3picFox

An hero...
I don't give a damn. Why would they care if I give a shit or not? They're dead. I'm guess I'm a sociopath? :/

I also LOL on the inside whenever people commit suicide.

I don't think you're a sociopath, maybe you just lack compassion.
Sociopaths are crazy murderers.
 
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