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Is the internet making corruption in western societies more difficult to hide?

CannonFodder

Resistance is futile! If 0 ohm
You know reading up on the latest news about such b.s. like the tsa giving a patdown to a toddler on the basis she was disabled(no seriously, apparently being physically disabled means you get searched and was even the reason given by the tsa), or the b.s. going on about CISPA right now I realized something. Could it be that the people claiming the world is going to hell in a hand basket are wrong, and that it's just with the exponential increase of information people are able to receive and transmit news about this kind of stuff going on at a much faster pace?

What I mean by that is fifty years ago if the government had made laws like the ones everyone is worried about nowadays nobody would have even batted a eye cause chances are unless it was something big and real big you wouldn't have heard about it. Nowadays all it takes is someone making a facebook page and all of a sudden there's millions of angry internet dwellers.

You, me and a ton of other people probably laugh at online petitions, however when you think about it whenever there's governmental corruption or such going on behind the scenes the last thing you would want is to get caught red handed on someone's camera phone and posted to facebook. Like what happened in new york. The short version is the city now allows patdowns even if the citizen wasn't doing anything wrong. Surprise 90% of the people getting searched by police were african american. In response there's now a iphone app for recording and sending it to the police.

Also more often than not whenever you see a agent or officer doing something shady they tell the person that they can't legally record the incident which is complete bullshit. Personally if that's the case there needs to be apps for in case something like this is happening for a cameraphone to stream it live to a police station or to your lawyers or such. The reason being is if it's live then they can take your phone, but if it's live then they can't delete it from the internet.


So what are your thoughts on this? Is the internet and cameraphones making it more difficult for corrupt individuals to hide evidence and brush it under the carpet?
 

Rivers Bluetail

Furry Little Blue Guy
That's pretty accurate. The thing is, the corruption's never going to go away. They're only going to find another way to hide it. Right now we're in an "in between" phase in society, and I have no idea what we're about to progress into. It's just like the invention of the printing press, except faster.
 

CannonFodder

Resistance is futile! If 0 ohm
That's pretty accurate. The thing is, the corruption's never going to go away. They're only going to find another way to hide it. Right now we're in an "in between" phase in society, and I have no idea what we're about to progress into. It's just like the invention of the printing press, except faster.
The most likely way they'll try to hide it is to make it illegal to film any governmental official, including police and such, or record them at any time or any place, including off the clock, unless they give permission.
 
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Rivers Bluetail

Furry Little Blue Guy
I think it's going to be quieter than that. It's not going to be illegal, it will just never be seen by anyone. The magic of censorship, just like burning books.
 

CannonFodder

Resistance is futile! If 0 ohm
I think it's going to be quieter than that. It's not going to be illegal, it will just never be seen by anyone. The magic of censorship, just like burning books.
Nah, that's too difficult. I was thinking along the lines of making it illegal to film governmental officials that way they really can arrest anyone that films a governmental official pulling illegal activity. Once something is out on the internet it is downright near impossible to remove it. However if you make it a class A felony to record a governmental official even if it's something like police brutality then that will scare people from putting it online or go to prison.

You could even spin it as to protect citizens or such even and call it something along the lines of "Police protection against destruction of evidence" bill or something and give it a political spin saying that filming cops while performing their duties has the potential of causing a mistrial or something.
 
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PsychicOtter

Otter Missionary
Interesting topic. I'm sure it makes it tougher to hide, and there might not be much of an increase in this stuff.
 

CannonFodder

Resistance is futile! If 0 ohm
Anything that facilitates the dissemination of information will.

There is so much corruption though, I'm sure people still don't hear about 99.99% of it.
We don't have to reach the point where everyone automatically knows about everything that happens; so much as we reach the point where it's impossible for a individual to not get caught red handed. We don't have to reach the point where everyone knows about every corrupt cop or such, so much as if cop wants to curb stomp someone they know they will be filmed regardless of what they try to do to stop it and they know it will end up on youtube and facebook where their boss, friends, co-workers, people at church, their parents, and family can see what they did.
 

ADF

Member
Any wonder then why governments keep trying to take control of information sources, particularly the Internet? In the name of combating piracy/terrorism of course.

The UK government in particular is trying to use the hacking scandal to regulate what the press can report on.
 

CannonFodder

Resistance is futile! If 0 ohm
Any wonder then why governments keep trying to take control of information sources, particularly the Internet? In the name of combating piracy/terrorism of course.

The UK government in particular is trying to use the hacking scandal to regulate what the press can report on.
I highly doubt they'll succeed. Most of the time the "hacking" is because someone in the government was being dumb. No matter how much a government tries to clamp down on the internet some employee somewhere is going to be gullible enough to fall for a email saying-
"We need you to reset your password, enter your password here to do so"
 
I'd say it a lot harder for people to hide the evidence of their actions, considering we now have hundreds cameras in the streets and the internet for them to be posted on. You get some really stupid policemen/women that wouldn't have gotten their comeuppance without their actions being filmed - like this. The police act so stupidly sometimes, it's unbelievable.
 

Golden

Member
Of course the internet is making it harder to conceal actions. But, I definitely think that corruption in the private sector continues to fly under the radar. It's strange why this trend is continuing, and why most people don't care. I think that all the asshats over at CNN and FOX put all the public servants under a magnifying glass until they can dig up some miniscule/fabricated dirt. They then sell this dirt to the masses, who drool over it and readily distribute it on Facebook and Twitter (the only 2 websites that 90% of the populace regularly visit). "Oh, Conrad Black stole $50 million dollars from a pension fund? Who gives a flying fuck because some no-name mayor of a backwater town SPENT TAXMONIEZ ON A PLANE TRIP!!!11"
 

Azure

100% organic vegan hubbas
is the color purple fabulous? answer this on your own and there ya go!
 

CannonFodder

Resistance is futile! If 0 ohm
Of course the internet is making it harder to conceal actions. But, I definitely think that corruption in the private sector continues to fly under the radar. It's strange why this trend is continuing, and why most people don't care. I think that all the asshats over at CNN and FOX put all the public servants under a magnifying glass until they can dig up some miniscule/fabricated dirt. They then sell this dirt to the masses, who drool over it and readily distribute it on Facebook and Twitter (the only 2 websites that 90% of the populace regularly visit). "Oh, Conrad Black stole $50 million dollars from a pension fund? Who gives a flying fuck because some no-name mayor of a backwater town SPENT TAXMONIEZ ON A PLANE TRIP!!!11"
Yeah, that's what bugs me. Even though we have the technology in mere seconds to find out some mayor spending tax dollars on a plane trip. our society and our news sources are lagging behind culturally and acting like it's still the 1990's or something. I think as the internet becomes more and more widespread, even in countries that have little internet connectivity, it will be harder and harder for society as a whole to ignore corruption in the private sector and such. Basically we'll eventually evolve as a society past petty news because technology will make it downright near impossible to keep a lid on corruption.

We all may laugh at online petitions and facebook petitions and such, but they show a future trend that we will probably see in the future of people on the internet acting as a collectivist towards certain ends and in turn effect the real world politically.
 
Nah, that's too difficult. I was thinking along the lines of making it illegal to film governmental officials that way they really can arrest anyone that films a governmental official pulling illegal activity. Once something is out on the internet it is downright near impossible to remove it. However if you make it a class A felony to record a governmental official even if it's something like police brutality then that will scare people from putting it online or go to prison.

You could even spin it as to protect citizens or such even and call it something along the lines of "Police protection against destruction of evidence" bill or something and give it a political spin saying that filming cops while performing their duties has the potential of causing a mistrial or something.
Nope, if you are filming government you CLEARLY are helping Al'Qaida by gathering intelligence for them, so it is the "(patriots against) terrorist intelligence" bill. :V

Yeah, that's what bugs me. Even though we have the technology in mere seconds to find out some mayor spending tax dollars on a plane trip. our society and our news sources are lagging behind culturally and acting like it's still the 1990's or something. I think as the internet becomes more and more widespread, even in countries that have little internet connectivity, it will be harder and harder for society as a whole to ignore corruption in the private sector and such. Basically we'll eventually evolve as a society past petty news because technology will make it downright near impossible to keep a lid on corruption.

We all may laugh at online petitions and facebook petitions and such, but they show a future trend that we will probably see in the future of people on the internet acting as a collectivist towards certain ends and in turn effect the real world politically.
That is technically possible, buuuuuuut: if people don't want to see, they won't see. If they concsider "Toddlers with Tiaras #554346644864418" and online reports about it more interesting than boring "Amnesty international" or "Reporters without borders" reports, then they just won't heed those informations.
Society is lagging behind technology, hopefully they will make it to your expectet future, but it's not guaranteed.
 
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ADF

Member
Another problem is being able to talk about available information, without the majority of people either ignoring it or stamping "conspiracy theory" on it, because they just don't want to know how fucked the world is. Nothing seems to be real to most people until a news network talks about it through their own filtered perspective, even though the information could have been floating around the internet years in advance.

On a side note, it was incredible to see the report published by the BBC on the Jimmy Savile scandal today was censored to hell. Look at it (1:05). This is a taxpayer funded organisation, in a taxpayer funded investigation as to whether the BBC protected a paedophile for decades, who are unapologetically arguing that we don't need to know what's in it... If there isn't massive public outrage in response to this, then we really are drones that will lap up anything they tell us.
 

CannonFodder

Resistance is futile! If 0 ohm
That is technically possible, buuuuuuut: if people don't want to see, they won't see. If they concsider "Toddlers with Tiaras #554346644864418" and online reports about it more interesting than boring "Amnesty international" or "Reporters without borders" reports, then they just won't heed those informations.
Society is lagging behind technology, hopefully they will make it to your expectet future, but it's not guaranteed.
The biggest problem is like you said, society is lagging behind technology. Right now western society acts like it's the 2000's instead of 2013. Society in general tends to lag behind technology, because technological changes are brought about by physical changes in electronics and such, where as society is reliant on the actual individuals.
 

Bambi

Member
I love how the argument however is "making corruption in western societies more difficult to hide", and not one question or answer has been launched at members of organized crime. Alas, crime is celebrated as rebellion, and so it is rarely examined when the internet fucks over some crazy assholes on the other side of the globe.

And again, a trap works both ways -- the government can no more hide their bullshit than an organized criminal. And not one is more preferable than the other, seeing as anyone minding their own shit is usually their target regardless once they know the truth. Assuming however the truth is as harmful as anyone else thought.
 
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Cocobanana

Member
The internet makes everything more difficult to hide. For every hundred or so folks who will believe whatever they're told, there will always be one who dares to question the so-called facts and seek the truth. Therefore, when inquisitive minds are better able to group together and strengthen their counter opinion, the rest of society is more likely to have the ugly truth forced onto them.
 

Rivers Bluetail

Furry Little Blue Guy
But what do we do about said corruption and crime though? Organizing people through the internet is so hit or miss. It seems like you either get mob mentality towards something not worthwhile or nobody cares. Everybody's mentality is that we need to bring more light to stuff and expose it. Reality check: Exposing stuff doesn't do ANYTHING anymore. After a month or two, people feel accomplished while crime continues on, out of sight, out of mind. It's really disheartening. People need to actually band together and fight for causes, none of that at-home-activist bullshit.
 

AshleyAshes

Arcade Snowmew Of Doom
We're talking about the same internet where you can start FaceBook chain letters saying 'For every like, Obama will give a dollar to this child dieing of cancer, never mind you that the photo is 8 years old and the kid is long dead.' and thousands of idiots will share it?
 

JerryFoxcoon

The classy Captain Furfag
I really hope it is!

I noticed that the longer a government/mayor stays, the more and more corruption there is. In Québec the governement is formed by another political party since pretty recently, and curiously I now hear tons of news about corruption, especially Montréal's municipal corruption of the last 15 to 20 years. To me it sounds that both former Montréal mayor and the former government was hiding it because they were involved in it. Now that they're gone everything is revealed.

Even locally, where I live, I've heard of outrageous cases of corruption and waste of taxpayers' money. I bet they'll be revealed as well when our mayor leaves.
 

lupinealchemist

Hamburger time.
I've got a sick feeling that in extreme circumstances people will be erased to cover up the corruption.
 
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