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My General Take on Pride Month

Felix Bernard

Chemist, Conservative, Mark Levin fan
This post is meant to share my personal opinion, it is not at all meant to judge or bash others who disagree.

As a bisexual, I am told that I ought to be celebrating this month with all colors of pride. However, I do not like the idea of pride - be it a tool of brandish toward the homophobe, or a flamboyant expression that demands attention from others.

As a technical member of the LGBT community on the basis of my orientation, I do not believe that the LGBT community at large has acted appropriately concerning the rights its has been given. Do I believe we should all be in the closet and be afraid of saying who we are attracted to? Not at all. Society has made the right step in stopping discrimination toward those who are sexual minorities. Gay and bisexual people should not be afraid to say that they are gay and bisexual, and their discrimination in the past by members of my religion is a dark stain for which I apologize with all my heart

But I do not believe pride marches, pride months, or other outlandish kinds of public celebration is appropriate. I believe these things just fuel the homophobe and give the LGBT community an aura of "in your face" which is counterproductive to cultivating a culture of acceptance and compassion. These are just my conservative-leaning musings, but I am not one to tell others they can't do it. I understand the attractiveness of such expression, but I think it is counterproductive. Sexual orientation is still a private thing, meant to be discussed between trusted individuals. Not saying we shouldn't strive to find acceptance within the society at large, but I am saying we shouldn't be flamboyant about it.
 
Pride is a celebration of the gay rights movement in the same sense that the 4th of July is a celebration of US independence. The people that are going to be offended by it don't need an excuse. The fact that someone not straight simply exists and isn't persecuted under the law is offensive to them.
 

Felix Bernard

Chemist, Conservative, Mark Levin fan
Pride is a celebration of the gay rights movement in the same sense that the 4th of July is a celebration of US independence. The people that are going to be offended by it don't need an excuse. The fact that someone not straight simply exists and isn't persecuted under the law is offensive to them.

I get that train of thought, but I think sexuality has much different connotations and must be treated differently.
 

Felix Bernard

Chemist, Conservative, Mark Levin fan
To put things in perspective, pride celibrates the end of things like mandatory conversion therapy, and forced sterilization. These where very real policies. It used to be a criminal offense to have gay sex.

Yes, and I am glad people of same sex related orientations are better treated in this age. We may have our discussions on marriage and adoption (which first of all I believe should be private matters and not controlled by the state - no marriage benefits). I am still iffy on flamboyant expression of pride, however. I do not believe flamboyant pride for any matter is a good thing.
 

Connor J. Coyote

¥otie ¥otezer
This post is meant to share my personal opinion, it is not at all meant to judge or bash others who disagree.

As a bisexual, I am told that I ought to be celebrating this month with all colors of pride. However, I do not like the idea of pride - be it a tool of brandish toward the homophobe, or a flamboyant expression that demands attention from others.

As a technical member of the LGBT community on the basis of my orientation, I do not believe that the LGBT community at large has acted appropriately concerning the rights its has been given. Do I believe we should all be in the closet and be afraid of saying who we are attracted to? Not at all. Society has made the right step in stopping discrimination toward those who are sexual minorities. Gay and bisexual people should not be afraid to say that they are gay and bisexual, and their discrimination in the past by members of my religion is a dark stain for which I apologize with all my heart

But I do not believe pride marches, pride months, or other outlandish kinds of public celebration is appropriate. I believe these things just fuel the homophobe and give the LGBT community an aura of "in your face" which is counterproductive to cultivating a culture of acceptance and compassion. These are just my conservative-leaning musings, but I am not one to tell others they can't do it. I understand the attractiveness of such expression, but I think it is counterproductive. Sexual orientation is still a private thing, meant to be discussed between trusted individuals. Not saying we shouldn't strive to find acceptance within the society at large, but I am saying we shouldn't be flamboyant about it.

I think you need a little bit of a "brush up" on your history, a bit dude. The reason that we have Pride celebrations today (at all) - is because it was very necessary, and much needed - (at the time that they were created) - which was a very dark period when gay folks (most of the time) couldn't be open about themsleves, (and in turn) often hid (in the shadows) - of a very hostile, ambivalent, (and frequently) discriminatory society. The "outlandish celebrations" as you refer to it - was (often times) a way for many people to (for once) be "open" about themselves, and not have to hide their true identities.. (sometimes for the first time in their lives).

Visibility was an essential element - in informing (and educating) the larger public about (us gay folks) and our existence.

The celebrations didn't just tell people, but it also *showed* people (that we exist) inside their community - which was often times the very first step in getting people (in the larger society) to change some of their attitudes.
 

Felix Bernard

Chemist, Conservative, Mark Levin fan
I think you need a little bit of a "brush up" on your history, a bit dude. The reason that we have Pride celebrations today (at all) - is because it was very necessary, and much needed - (at the time that they were created) - which was a very dark period when gay folks (most of the time) couldn't be open about themsleves, (and in turn) often hid (in the shadows) - of a very hostile, ambivalent, (and frequently) discriminatory society. The "outlandish celebrations" as you refer to it - was (often times) a way for many people to (for once) be "open" about themselves, and not have to hide their true identities.. (sometimes for the first time in their lives).

Visibility was an essential element - in informing (and educating) the larger public about (us gay folks) and our existence.

The celebrations didn't just tell people, but it also *showed* people (that we exist) inside their community - which was often times the very first step in getting people (in the larger society) to change some of their attitudes.

I guess I am thrown off by the term and usage of “pride” in this. I do not believe in pride in the sense of boasting in oneself, I find that to be reprehensible. But I guess there is a point to be made in what you are saying.
I have a complex view on this. I am not in agreement with those who wish to boast in themselves, nor am I in agreement with those who wish to ignore or undermine the history of discrimination.
 
There is a difference in having pride and having excessive and ill placed pride. It is one thing to be proud of completing a calculus course for example, it is another thing to swing that pride around and belittle others who have not achieved the same. It is also another thing to be prideful of things not worth being proud of, such as being proud of dropping out of school and being utterly ignorant.

The pride celebration is that first definition of pride, as it celebrates the victories won for civil rights for those applicable, but does not seek to belittle those who currently lack civil rights ideally. There are some people who go to pride celebrations who are belittling of other's civil rights, but that is their personal damage.
 

quoting_mungo

Well-Known Member
I guess I am thrown off by the term and usage of “pride” in this. I do not believe in pride in the sense of boasting in oneself, I find that to be reprehensible. But I guess there is a point to be made in what you are saying.
I don't view the name "Pride" as a literal "this is something worth boasting about" pride. Rather, I view it as the opposite of shame. It's about saying "there's actually a lot of us and we're not okay with you trying to silence us" (in the metaphorical sense - if it's not okay for a gay couple to kiss or hold hands in public, but it's okay for a straight couple to do so, that's a form of silencing in this context).
 

ThunderSnowolf

Dead Account
As a pansexual, I feel somewhat offended by this either way. This kind of defeats the whole purpose of pride in general. Actually, hearing that pride month is bad only makes me feel ashamed to be pan. It reminds me of all of the years I've been told that my orientation is invalid, nonexistent, or that I would have sex with fruit. I'm not going to yiff my own food. The same people who shared your opinion told me that I have to choose whether I'm gay or straight even though I'm neither. They then told me to kill myself and for years I've been considering it. Does that not mean anything to you about pride or how much it means to people like me? When I came out of the closet, I didn't want to jump back in again, yet it feels like I have to. So much for real pride... Just because of views like this one, I feel I'm just going to call it "shame month" from now on.

Lastly, this can be combated. Just start straight pride; problem solved.
 
As a pansexual, I feel somewhat offended by this either way. This kind of defeats the whole purpose of pride in general. Actually, hearing that pride month is bad only makes me feel ashamed to be pan. It reminds me of all of the years I've been told that my orientation is invalid, nonexistent, or that I would have sex with fruit. I'm not going to yiff my own food. The same people who shared your opinion told me that I have to choose whether I'm gay or straight even though I'm neither. They then told me to kill myself and for years I've been considering it. Does that not mean anything to you about pride or how much it means to people like me? When I came out of the closet, I didn't want to jump back in again, yet it feels like I have to. So much for real pride... Just because of views like this one, I feel I'm just going to call it "shame month" from now on.

Lastly, this can be combated. Just start straight pride; problem solved.
Lets not start straight pride, I don't want to deal with a bunch of butthurt basement dwellers upset that gay people can fuck without getting their balls chopped off parading down main street.

There are problems within the LGBT community of acceptance of people with other identities under that umbrella. You would think people who have suffered oppression would know better, but people are people.
 
Z

ZeroVoidTime

Guest
This post is meant to share my personal opinion, it is not at all meant to judge or bash others who disagree.

As a bisexual, I am told that I ought to be celebrating this month with all colors of pride. However, I do not like the idea of pride - be it a tool of brandish toward the homophobe, or a flamboyant expression that demands attention from others.

As a technical member of the LGBT community on the basis of my orientation, I do not believe that the LGBT community at large has acted appropriately concerning the rights its has been given. Do I believe we should all be in the closet and be afraid of saying who we are attracted to? Not at all. Society has made the right step in stopping discrimination toward those who are sexual minorities. Gay and bisexual people should not be afraid to say that they are gay and bisexual, and their discrimination in the past by members of my religion is a dark stain for which I apologize with all my heart

But I do not believe pride marches, pride months, or other outlandish kinds of public celebration is appropriate. I believe these things just fuel the homophobe and give the LGBT community an aura of "in your face" which is counterproductive to cultivating a culture of acceptance and compassion. These are just my conservative-leaning musings, but I am not one to tell others they can't do it. I understand the attractiveness of such expression, but I think it is counterproductive. Sexual orientation is still a private thing, meant to be discussed between trusted individuals. Not saying we shouldn't strive to find acceptance within the society at large, but I am saying we shouldn't be flamboyant about it.
That is fine and you are right. It is just some individuals like to be out and proud as that is just how they express themselves.
 

TrishaCat

The Cat in the FAF
I used to feel similarly as you OP, and I'm still unsure of how I feel about pride parades. But pride month being what it is, where everyone in the LGBT community is expressing and being open about themselves, it helps give people who might feel scared to express themselves confidence. I myself never told my IRL friends that I was bi before this month. No one knew. But seeing everyone else being so open about themselves gave me courage, and there's probably a lot of other people in similar situations. People need that confidence boost that pride month provides. It helps such people feel better about themselves and not be scared. And that's cool if you ask me.
 

WithMyBearHands

Smudge and arrogant
I don’t have a problem with the idea of a pride festival, but I really dislike what it’s become. Every year it seems more and more to be just an excuse for LGBT to get utterly hammered in public with few social repercussions. Many people act like children. It’s important to be proud of who you are, it’s not okay to act like you’re better than everyone because you’re a literal walking rainbow with feathery wings.
 
W

WolfyAmbassador

Guest
I don’t have a problem with the idea of a pride festival, but I really dislike what it’s become. Every year it seems more and more to be just an excuse for LGBT to get utterly hammered in public with few social repercussions. Many people act like children. It’s important to be proud of who you are, it’s not okay to act like you’re better than everyone because you’re a literal walking rainbow with feathery wings.
Literally looks like a bunch of a attention whores looking and doing perverted things in front of the children that come there too.
 

WithMyBearHands

Smudge and arrogant
Literally looks like a bunch of a attention whores looking and doing perverted things in front of the children that come there too.
The sad part is I know the vast majority of them don’t even know why we celebrate. The last festival I went to was a drunk sexcapade involving a Marilyn Monroe cosplayer
 

Troj

Your Friendly Neighborhood Dino Therapist
Haters are gonna hate.

People in general should strive to lead lives that they can be proud of; should generally consider how their behavior comes across, and should think about how their actions may reflect on those around them.

But, there's a tendency to hold minorities to an even higher standard than the general population. In order to get ahead or make good impression in certain milieus or situations, some of us may unfortunately have to play that game, but we should nonetheless recognize that this game is unfair.

Someone should not have to be a saint in order to be worthy of rights, dignity, and basic respect.

We need to be savvy to the fact that homophobic concern-trolls will latch onto every example of a dude in assless chaps or people snogging on the grass in order to undermine LGBTQ rights and visibility, and will even fabricate or grossly exaggerate examples of bad behavior to make their case.

Pride is fundamentally about embracing who we are without shame, reflecting on the lessons of history, raising our glasses to those who have sacrificed so that we might someday walk in the sun, and recognizing that we're not home free yet. It's a party, sure, but it's so much more.

Because we can go backwards as easily as we can go forwards, we can never afford to take Pride for granted.

So, my sense is that people should make a point to generally behave themselves at Pride (and otherwise) and not act like total dipshits, but at the same time, not get too bent out of shape about what homophobes think, because they'll never truly be happy as long as LGBTQ just exist openly.

When we're uncomfortable with someone else's behavior, we should ask ourselves why, and if we'd be just as uneasy with a member of a different group or tribe behaving the same way. It's pretty telling how some folks are embarrassed by gay people being "flamboyant," but don't even blink when straight people behave the same way.
 
O

Okami_No_Heishi

Guest
The Church teaches people that pride is a sin, even to this day, right? But back in the old days, you were punished by the church for showing pride. Like all tbe otber "sins". And homosexuality was above all the worst sin, even though the church hierarchy often practiced it behind closed doors. But like a lot of things the church did in the dark ages is still taught today, the same hypocrisy still happens today. And homosexuality is not a sin. It never was. But of course men wrote the book. And men preach their own interpretations of it. Jesus taught love, acceptance, and forgiveness. Never did he preach hate like a lot of his followers do.
 
O

Okami_No_Heishi

Guest
Haters are gonna hate.

People in general should strive to lead lives that they can be proud of; should generally consider how their behavior comes across, and should think about how their actions may reflect on those around them.

But, there's a tendency to hold minorities to an even higher standard than the general population. In order to get ahead or make good impression in certain milieus or situations, some of us may unfortunately have to play that game, but we should nonetheless recognize that this game is unfair.

Someone should not have to be a saint in order to be worthy of rights, dignity, and basic respect.

We need to be savvy to the fact that homophobic concern-trolls will latch onto every example of a dude in assless chaps or people snogging on the grass in order to undermine LGBTQ rights and visibility, and will even fabricate or grossly exaggerate examples of bad behavior to make their case.

Pride is fundamentally about embracing who we are without shame, reflecting on the lessons of history, raising our glasses to those who have sacrificed so that we might someday walk in the sun, and recognizing that we're not home free yet. It's a party, sure, but it's so much more.

Because we can go backwards as easily as we can go forwards, we can never afford to take Pride for granted.

So, my sense is that people should make a point to generally behave themselves at Pride (and otherwise) and not act like total dipshits, but at the same time, not get too bent out of shape about what homophobes think, because they'll never truly be happy as long as LGBTQ just exist openly.

When we're uncomfortable with someone else's behavior, we should ask ourselves why, and if we'd be just as uneasy with a member of a different group or tribe behaving the same way. It's pretty telling how some folks are embarrassed by gay people being "flamboyant," but don't even blink when straight people behave the same way.
It is called hypocrisy.
 

Troj

Your Friendly Neighborhood Dino Therapist
Minorities are often held to a double standard, which is hypocrisy of a kind, yes.

In this case, I'd actually like LGBTQ to stop and reflect on the messages they've received about themselves from both the queer community and the larger straight society, for good or ill. What does it mean to be a "real" or a "true" or a "good" queer person, versus a "fake" or "bad" one, and where did those schemas originate from? Consider your idea of "embarrassing" behavior---what does it entail or encompass, where did it possibly originate from, and does it serve you and others? What are you afraid will happen if queer people are seen engaging in "bad" or "embarrassing" behaviors? What are you afraid will happen if you or others are judged by the queer community for not meeting certain standards?
 

KILL.MAIM.KILL

Angry Lizard King
Banned
I agree that it's counter-productive, and in my opinion, the flamboyant gay stereotype is harmful, even or especially when it's the gay community enforcing it.

I also don't see why anyone should be proud of their sexuality. It's nothing special.
I'm ashamed of my sexuality, so, I am biased, but even if I wasn't, I wouldn't want special attention for it. I would want to be considered normal, the same as a fully straight person.

Surely gay and bisexual people should be trying to get people to understand that they're just as normal as anyone else, not dressing themselves up with colorful and tacky accessories and sharing their fetishes with the public?
 
B

BahgDaddy

Guest
The sad part is I know the vast majority of them don’t even know why we celebrate. The last festival I went to was a drunk sexcapade involving a Marilyn Monroe cosplayer

People have always found excuses to have drunk, slightly sexually risqué public events. That's not particularly specific to the LGBT Pride people, so pretending it is, is pretty stupid.
 
O

Okami_No_Heishi

Guest
People have always found excuses to have drunk, slightly sexually risqué public events. That's not particularly specific to the LGBT Pride people, so pretending it is, is pretty stupid.
Amen! Look at Mardi Gras! Or Carnival! Or any NFL game or College Football Game! But if gay people do it it is bad!(thick dripping sarcasm)
 
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