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[POLL]Has the fandom changed in worse or in better over the years?

Has the fandom changed in worse or in better over the years?


  • Total voters
    84

Fallowfox

Are we moomin, or are we dancer?
That's what CRT creeps do with EVERY SINGLE GROUP, they make EVERYBODY's identity fully political. Maybe instead of forcing politics on everybody it would be quicker, smoother and less absurd to just kick these people out, all of them.

Frank, just, how about like...one day where you don't bring your views on american politics up?
One day.


Probably because the average age in the fandom is 20~ yo nowadays, so they weren't even there 10 years ago to judge.

I think the 'fandom' is a pretty loosely defined thing anyway, so it's probably the most honest answer. Any number of things are always changing, and whether the net sum is good or bad is really anybody's guess.
 
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Yakamaru

Autumn wolf
Within the fandom - I think the "popufur" culture has gotten worse. Not just in the more obvious cases of followers defending someone for doing really abhorrent things, but also in situations where a "popufur" has completely taken advantage of their own followers, guilting them into financial support even while making horrible remarks aimed at those who struggle with behavioral or learning issues in everyday life.

I'm not totally against "popufurs" themselves - just the cult-like mentality of some of the followers.
It's called celebrity worship, and is largely an American thing I've noticed. Not necessarily bad in and of itself but can be extremely annoying.

People can and will do bad things and it's important to be consistent on calling that shit out.
 
O

O.D.D.

Guest
It's called celebrity worship, and is largely an American thing I've noticed. Not necessarily bad in and of itself but can be extremely annoying.

People can and will do bad things and it's important to be consistent on calling that shit out.
We discarded royalty in the formation of the country and then replaced it later with new kinds of royalty
 

Fallowfox

Are we moomin, or are we dancer?
The saints of ancient churches were essentially the celebrities of their day, weren't they?

Humans be like this for some reason.

We discarded royalty in the formation of the country and then replaced it later with new kinds of royalty

We'd be willing to swap!
 

Frank Gulotta

Send us your floppy
Frank, just, how about like...one day where you don't bring your views on american politics up?
One day.

It's like, you only exist in order to live and breathe the political subjects that make you angry, and that your only purpose in life is to contaminate everybody else with it. :{
I didn't know you considered a few forum posts as someone's only purpose in life. That must make your own life pretty wretched, but it's not my own situation. Also are you that scared I could "contaminate" people with my heretical opinions just because I lament the fact so many people judge others on the basis of their skin color and other such factors?
 

Yakamaru

Autumn wolf
The saints of ancient churches were essentially the celebrities of their day, weren't they?

Humans be like this for some reason.
Difference is, the saints actually knew how to behave in public. Their anuses weren't jealous of their mouths because all the shit coming out the wrong end. The bathroom must be very lonely. >:

~Edit~
It also shows that popufurs are normal people like everyone else, which is nice. Fun to watch some of the crap they spew. =3=
 
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KimberVaile

Officially elected and actual ruler of FAF
It's called celebrity worship, and is largely an American thing I've noticed. Not necessarily bad in and of itself but can be extremely annoying.

People can and will do bad things and it's important to be consistent on calling that shit out.
It happens everywhere, plenty of European countries engage in the same actor/musician/entertainer worship.
Before that it was theater actors, and before that opera singers.

It's been consistently pathetic and universal. The fandom just replaces actors with porn artists as the object of worship.
I did notice the actual merit and talent of people of worship has steadily degraded. At the very least, you could claim an Opera Singer had considerable talent, can't say the same about modern musicians, usually.
 
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O.D.D.

Guest
It happens everywhere, plenty of European countries engage in the same actor/musician/entertainer worship.
Before that it was theater actors, and before that opera singers.

It's been consistently pathetic and universal. The fandom just replaces actors with porn artists as the object of worship.
I did notice the actual merit and talent of people of worship has steadily degraded. At the very least, you could claim an Opera Singer had considerable talent, can't say the same about modern musicians, usually.
There are a lot of incredibly talented musicians in the modern scene, they're just not the ones that get worshipped usually
 

Yakamaru

Autumn wolf
It happens everywhere, plenty of European countries engage in the same actor/musician/entertainer worship.
Before that it was theater actors, and before that opera singers.

It's been consistently pathetic and universal. The fandom just replaces actors with porn artists as the object of worship.
I did notice the actual merit and talent of people of worship has steadily degraded. At the very least, you could claim an Opera Singer had considerable talent, can't say the same about modern musicians, usually.
It does indeed happen everywhere, that is not something I will argue against obviously. It is however a lot more noticeable in America in particular.
 

KimberVaile

Officially elected and actual ruler of FAF
It does indeed happen everywhere, that is not something I will argue against obviously. It is however a lot more noticeable in America in particular.
With how the British gossip about figureheads with no actual power and form an entire tabloid industry on it. I would disagree. It's just as bad in plenty other countries.
 

Yakamaru

Autumn wolf
With how the British gossip about figureheads with no actual power and form an entire tabloid industry on it. I would disagree. It's just as bad in plenty other countries.
And I disagree with your disagreement. UwU
Still love ya tho

There's gossip and there's going far and wide to defend whatever dumb celebrity you like. And boy do some of the Japanese go far and wide. :p
 

Yakamaru

Autumn wolf
throws a whole lot of nickels at
 
Yeah, It's gotten worse. Between the binary politics and some zoo/pedophile ring being outted each week, on top of the usual social fumbles this fandom is still king of, it's even more of a joke. Social media has not helped, but I can't really pretend that's exclusive to furries.

The unchecked horniness hasn't changed. Been a problem since the 80's. And it will never change. Sex is the core defining trait of the fandom. You just kind of have to make your own microcosm and cultivate it to your taste if you want to avoid the more lascivious denizens.

It's nothing unavoidable at least. You can generally avoid most of it on any site you join. I see all the dumb shit we do, but I just don't get involved. Like politics for example.
You can avoid any hard leaning dumbasses by just...shutting the fuck up. Your uninsightful political stances on limited ass Twitter don't matter anyway so you can easily avoid trouble with people by just not inviting it or interjecting in arguments. It's just that people can't resist the temptation of thinking they intellectually owned some random in 240 characters.
 

Firuthi Dragovic

Gamer Dragon, former speedrunner
I see all the dumb shit we do, but I just don't get involved. Like politics for example.
You can avoid any hard leaning dumbasses by just...shutting the fuck up. Your uninsightful political stances on limited ass Twitter don't matter anyway so you can easily avoid trouble with people by just not inviting it or interjecting in arguments. It's just that people can't resist the temptation of thinking they intellectually owned some random in 240 characters.
It's almost like these people have no other struggles in their life, so they have to make one in order to feel like they exist.

That or... I hesitate to say "they're prisoners of society, thinking they HAVE to obey in order to fit in", unfortunately that's EXACTLY what it looks like to me.

I lament that ever since the forums went down I can't find that post by one of our older furs that defined "what counts as political" - as that's going to become more and more relevant as time goes on. Seems not a lot of people get taught what they need to keep to themselves.


Difference is, the saints actually knew how to behave in public. Their anuses weren't jealous of their mouths because all the shit coming out the wrong end. The bathroom must be very lonely. >:
......yyyyyyeah, I'm going to have to check into the histories of those "saints" one of these days when my brain allows me time to care. Part of me feels like the modern depictions of these people just stripped out all the bad parts and that they're only "saints" because some distant authority demanded they were.
 

Attaman

"I say we forget this business and run."
I lament that ever since the forums went down I can't find that post by one of our older furs that defined "what counts as political" - as that's going to become more and more relevant as time goes on. Seems not a lot of people get taught what they need to keep to themselves.
In some regards: Yeah, people share far too much online. Particularly considering how many donor groups and parties - even just among the English-speaking internet - are itching at the bit to legalize things like "It's okay to deny these people medical care" or "It's okay to hold these people indefinitely in jail" and whatnot. To say nothing of how anything you post on the internet is increasingly most likely to stay on the internet forever.

And we've shared several times in this thread alone (let alone FAF as a whole) how much of the internet is basically a honeypot for selling people's personal information: A big reason a lot of psychiatrists are advising against certain online mental health services (for just one example) is several of those gladly admit in their ToS / Contracts that "Hey, any information you volunteer through our service is free to share / sell". And they, quite understandably, have concerns about people advertising directly to Facebook, Twitter, et al information farms "Oh yeah [person] has [diagnosed / undiagnosed condition]".

On the other: I invite you to look up the recent clusterfuck that was the "Free Fur All" convention for why a lot of people have hesitancy when people start to bang on this drum. Big trigger warning list ahead though as, uh, lots of blatant slurs, threats, discussions of murdering people / fantasies of murdering people, goading people to commit suicide, more slurs, explicit hate-group iconography, dangerous levels of 2G (though arguably any levels constitute as dangerous for one's mental healthy)...

Basically what I'm saying is considering the usual FAFer's level of self-control and similar to dipping pool test strip and giving it a good shake, by bringing the up above in about a page we'll probably know real quick if at least one person's motivation for beating on this drum ties back to said hesitancy. Or if I'll eat crow.
 

Firuthi Dragovic

Gamer Dragon, former speedrunner
On the other: I invite you to look up the recent clusterfuck that was the "Free Fur All" convention for why a lot of people have hesitancy when people start to bang on this drum. Big trigger warning list ahead though as, uh, lots of blatant slurs, threats, discussions of murdering people / fantasies of murdering people, goading people to commit suicide, more slurs, explicit hate-group iconography, dangerous levels of 2G (though arguably any levels constitute as dangerous for one's mental healthy)...
....

Hard pass. I don't care if the invitation was sarcastic or genuine, hard pass on this one.

I know you JUST SPOKE about shared medical information, but part of my condition includes echolalia, and I mean for way longer than the usual developmental phase of repetition. I get anywhere near this shit, this is going to repeat endlessly in my words and thoughts.

I learned from watching others EXACTLY how much damage that can cause. And not just to me.

I generally don't like to shut down an invitation to reality in my better moments, but it's truly a matter of everyone's safety that I DON'T try to enlighten myself here.
 

Attaman

"I say we forget this business and run."
....

Hard pass. I don't care if the invitation was sarcastic or genuine, hard pass on this one.
Entirely understandable. And also why I included the warning: It is neither a particularly light subject matter nor series of examples.
I know you JUST SPOKE about shared medical information, but part of my condition includes echolalia, and I mean for way longer than the usual developmental phase of repetition. I get anywhere near this shit, this is going to repeat endlessly in my words and thoughts.

I learned from watching others EXACTLY how much damage that can cause. And not just to me.

I generally don't like to shut down an invitation to reality in my better moments, but it's truly a matter of everyone's safety that I DON'T try to enlighten myself here.
Oof. My apologies. If it's any small consolation, this probably at least gave a tag to mute for future you's sake / convenience. I would very much recommend against looking up the finer details in this case.
 

Fallowfox

Are we moomin, or are we dancer?
I didn't know you considered a few forum posts as someone's only purpose in life. That must make your own life pretty wretched, but it's not my own situation. Also are you that scared I could "contaminate" people with my heretical opinions just because I lament the fact so many people judge others on the basis of their skin color and other such factors?


I think we can both agree that you constantly bring up political topics that are designed to cause arguments.

Nobody is criticising you for not judging people based on their skin colour. This is a good example of the pointless fights you constantly try to start. :\



With how the British gossip about figureheads with no actual power and form an entire tabloid industry on it. I would disagree. It's just as bad in plenty other countries.

Currently some really big drama about this related to crimes they're accused of.

I completely agree with you that this idea of America being the gaudiest most celebrity-obsessed culture is just a myth. It's something europeans say to each other in order to make ourselves feel superior to americans, tbh.


......yyyyyyeah, I'm going to have to check into the histories of those "saints" one of these days when my brain allows me time to care. Part of me feels like the modern depictions of these people just stripped out all the bad parts and that they're only "saints" because some distant authority demanded they were.

You're definitely right on that one! Some well known saints canonised in this century faked medical miracles, and covered up evidence when the supposed benefactors of those miracles complained they were being exploited.
 
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Frank Gulotta

Send us your floppy
I think we can both agree that you constantly bring up political topics that are designed to cause arguments.

Nobody is criticising you for not judging people based on their skin colour. This is a good example of the pointless fights you constantly try to start. :\
I'm confused, you consider that being vocal about judging people based on the color of their skin being bad, is "designed to cause arguments"? we're not in the 1950s you know, it shouldn't be controversial. Yet it apparently is. Whatever the current status quo is (I think you're plainly aware of it), it's not a good thing and perhaps people should have the courage to speak up about it without being compared to a disease by those too cowardly to do so.
 

Fallowfox

Are we moomin, or are we dancer?
I'm confused, you consider that being vocal about judging people based on the color of their skin being bad, is "designed to cause arguments"? we're not in the 1950s you know, it shouldn't be controversial. Yet it apparently is. Whatever the current status quo is (I think you're plainly aware of it), it's not a good thing and perhaps people should have the courage to speak up about it without being compared to a disease by those too cowardly to do so.

'Critical race theory' in this context is a poorly defined political bogeyman that regularly does the rounds in conservative circles in the USA.

Constantly trying to start discussions about this political subject is not equivalent to opposing racism.

This is a good example of the binary politics that people are complaining about in this thread. 'Either you agree with my angry talking points or I will insinuate you tolerate racism, one of the worst evils of human history' is the kind of stuff that people are just tired of, Frank.
 
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Frank Gulotta

Send us your floppy
'Critical race theory' in this context is a poorly defined political bogeyman that regularly does the rounds in conservative circles in the USA.

Constantly trying to start discussions about this political subject is not equivalent to opposing racism.
Oh I'm familiar with the "it's totes not real lol" argument, it generally melts in a blaze of frantic outraged shrieking when the people start speaking up against it because they're fed up with racial indoctrination. Weird, why would these "intellectuals" defend so fanatically something that doesn't exist?
We're tired of the gaslighting and the 1930s tier racial rhetoric
 

Fallowfox

Are we moomin, or are we dancer?
Oh I'm familiar with the "it's totes not real lol" argument, it generally melts in a blaze of frantic outraged shrieking when the people start speaking up against it because they're fed up with racial indoctrination. Weird, why would these "intellectuals" defend so fanatically something that doesn't exist?
We're tired of the gaslighting and the 1930s tier racial rhetoric


This is a good example of the binary politics that people are complaining about in this thread. 'Either you agree with my angry talking points or I will insinuate you tolerate racism, one of the worst evils of human history' is the kind of stuff that people are just tired of, Frank.

Have a look at how silly you're being. In this post, you're implying that people who don't agree with your angry political posts are like the Germans from the 1930's.
 
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