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Recent FA Outage Explanation?

TehSean

weasyl.com/profile/naoki
So I hear rumors that FA's gonna be sold.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v321/HellFurry/preyfarjournal.jpg

I would assume that this is the "rather nasty message at Dragoneer's expense" referred to in the article:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v321/HellFurry/IFAILITITISRUNNINGAWEBSITE.gif

THE FOLLOWING IS A TRANSCRIPT OF WHAT IS WRITTEN IN THE LINK.

"Fur Affinity is offline temporarily"
Upon coming home tonight, Alkora approached me in IM and said he was having monetary issues due to college and, apparently, an unfortunate case of black mold. Her then proceeded to inform me he was considering selling Fur Affinity to the highest bidder and was looking for $10,000, but would "make me a deal" for about $7-8,000.

Naturally, I took great offense to that. It almost felt like extortion. "Here, you pay me a $8,000, or I'll sell it to the highest bidder and you and everybody else will lose!" A rather damned if you do, damned if you don't moment. Considering I moved to Kyrgyzstan to help support the site and ensure they're be money, this is a slap in the face. I gave up personal freedom, friendship, cats and just about everything goes overseas to help FA, and this is how I get repayed? How the community gets treated?

I have dumped thousands of my own dollars into Fur Affinity, and all that Alkora has paid for... is the domain registration fee. That's it. Yes, we've all sunk hard earned time and money into the site, but he decided he wanted to sell the site for profit. Profit off of the massive money I, and countless contributers put into the site. Over $15,000 worth of donations since June 2006, and that's nothing to laugh at.

Naturally, I didn't take well to that, and got rather pissed off.

Alkora decided to re-direct his DNS for the site and post a rather nasty message at my expense. Well, that's right. The blame all lies in me, because I refuse to pay thousands of dollars for what I have been primarily supporting financially by myself since December 2005. Alkora has barely spent a single penny on things, and I have the bills to prove it. I have the invoices for the servers and hosting fees in my name. He created it, and for that I am thankful, but I am not going to bend over and pay to keep the community's site alive.

FA is not dead, and will return.

We're working on restoring services right now. Rest assured, your data is safe.
I own the servers and they're currently in a secure position, and there's no worry of loss. As co-owner, I have kept the site secure, and as co-owner for FA, I am not going to see the site go under for one person's greed.

The site is a community site, not a business. I intend to keep it that way. I will not see Fur Affinity go under because somebody wants to auction it off to the highest bidder.

End
 

dave hyena

A wonderous moorhen
It's internal drama over the ownership of the site. The domain name was temporarily yanked, but the data is all safe.

Negotiations are currently under way.
 
that's what I call greedy... that's like selling your family off to the highest bidder (whoever would want my family XD)
 

Bokracroc

Bokra, come out to pla-ay
Alternately, you could venture into the FA Discussion section and keep the Drama there plzkthzbai.
 

TehSean

weasyl.com/profile/naoki
It isn't "just" drama.

Most of FA's drama didn't really have the site hanging in the balance.

But then again, a lot of it did. Brushing it off and ignoring it doesn't appear to have worked in the past because it keeps cropping up.

So. stfuggnextmap!rollthedice
 

Bokracroc

Bokra, come out to pla-ay
Or he just hijacked the DNS and everyone found a way around it making the attempt PHAIL (in with extra PH!)
 

LimeyKat

luvs her sum fuzzy anime
Dave Hyena said:
Negotiations are currently under way.

If he in fact only owns the domain (less than $10 a year) and doesn't own anything else, there is nothing to negotiate. Buy a new domain.
 

uncia

Member
LimeyKat said:
If he in fact only owns the domain (less than $10 a year) and doesn't own anything else, there is nothing to negotiate. Buy a new domain.

Sure... The site may be back up and running, but you're telling me there's not a single line of Alkora's code left on the platform it's running on? (How much that may be patched and/or written by other people, too, is besides the point).
Can you tell me whether there's any (c) message on the code and whose name, if any, is on there if so...?

i.e. Probably best not to try to simplify everything into a flagwaving exercise over domain names and "holding those to ransom", please, if people don't /actually/ know the full details.

JM02c/fwiw in passing, anyhow,
d.
 

LimeyKat

luvs her sum fuzzy anime
but you're telling me there's not a single line of Alkora's code left on the platform it's running on?

If you're going to consider him like that, then you have to consider everyone else who fixed and added new code when it comes to Alkora thinking he can do whatever he wants with the site. If Preyfar can't, Alkora can't.

At any rate, One d*ck move deserves another. With Ferrox eventually on the way it can be as temporary as the code workers can possibly make it. *shrugs*
 

dave hyena

A wonderous moorhen
This isn't a simple issue that can be resolved easily or at all through forceful or unilateral action or the like.

I know it sounds more attractive to do just do something immediately and forcefully, but the thing is, we (obviously yeah) want FA to be stable and functional. The best way of ensuring that and working this situation out in the most efficient way is to talk to the parties involved over what has happened and how to come to a resolution over this issue.

Immediate and forceful reactions are things like (and can result in) stuff like domain names being re-directed and everyone getting confused and/or pissed off over it. It would drag things out and shake things about.

As long as there is negotiations, something is being done about this and the site is up and stable. The negotiations will be pursued to a successful conclusion and hopefully there will be all the less fallout and no more stuff like what happened earlier for it.
 

LimeyKat

luvs her sum fuzzy anime
Someone said they were going to consult legal council on the whole issue tomorrow anyway. It wont really matter what I say on the issue, but that's how I'd do it in Preyfars shoes.
 

uncia

Member
LimeyKat said:
but you're telling me there's not a single line of Alkora's code left on the platform it's running on?

If you're going to consider him like that, then you have to consider everyone else who fixed and added new code when it comes to Alkora thinking he can do whatever he wants with the site. If Preyfar can't, Alkora can't.
*nodnods*. Hence the pointlessness in those over-simplified, even knee-jerk approaches I've been seeing posted in various places.
As soon as FA went back up, the mudslinging at Jheryn started. Can understand, phps, but not smart, IMHO...

LimeyKat said:
At any rate, One d*ck move deserves another. With Ferrox eventually on the way it can be as temporary as the code workers can possibly make it. *shrugs*
Even with that "eventually" (d'you have a date for that?), that's better phrased as a /positive/ move to better functionality, rather than a "good, we've fixed that code ownership issue", I'd've hoped.

LimeyKat said:
Someone said they were going to consult legal council on the whole issue tomorrow anyway. It wont really matter what I say on the issue, but that's how I'd do it in Preyfars shoes.
As opposed to communications beforehand to try to ensure the situation didn't arise in the first instance? Things like this rarely appear "totally out of the blue".
Anyhow, best leave 'em too it, although the community concern is inevitable. *shrugs*

Cheers,
David.
 

LimeyKat

luvs her sum fuzzy anime
uncia said:
*nodnods*. Hence the pointlessness in those over-simplified, even knee-jerk approaches I've been seeing posted in various places.

I'd be VERY interested in knowing if the law sides with the simplified approach, preferably without need of removing the current code since every edit and add on by someone else made it less and less his own. It simply would not make any sense if Alkora retained legal sway over the site at this point, but yeah, we'll see what they conclude on. Ultimately they (one or both) are able to decide where the site goes from here.
 

uncia

Member
LimeyKat said:
uncia said:
*nodnods*. Hence the pointlessness in those over-simplified, even knee-jerk approaches I've been seeing posted in various places.

I'd be VERY interested in knowing if the law sides with the simplified approach, preferably without need of removing the current code since every edit and add on by someone else made it less and less his own.

Interesting concept, but not legally sound I suspect if anyone's thinking that leaves precisely zero leverage with the original coder/s.
I certainly don't recall Jheryn doing coding for "FA" on a work-for-hire basis and given that we have people feeling they can go around raising legal action when they didn't even write a single line of code...

A lot more clear-cut than that in this case and having (c) messages in the code helps to a degree depending on what those read, but if Jheryn didn't actually formally hand over full ownership of the code (regardless of what the reality of code maintenance has been for some time now, with thanks to yak) there's certainly plenty potential for complications.

Definitely not just a simple domain name matter, anyhow.

LimeyKat said:
It simply would not make any sense if Alkora retained legal sway over the site at this point, but yeah, we'll see what they conclude on. Ultimately they (one or both) are able to decide where the site goes from here.

*nodnods* for level-headedness on that.
 

Morrigan

New Member
So can we get a status update ... like what the heck is going on now? I have really grown to love this community and would hate to see it disappear for no good reason other than a powerplay of some sort. Where are we to go if FA goes bye bye? There doesn't seem to be any place like it. :cry:
 

LimeyKat

luvs her sum fuzzy anime
Morrigan said:
So can we get a status update ... like what the heck is going on now? I have really grown to love this community and would hate to see it disappear for no good reason other than a powerplay of some sort. Where are we to go if FA goes bye bye? There doesn't seem to be any place like it. :cry:

I wouldn't expect one just yet. Too soon.
 

Gennets

Member
MOAR FURRY DRAMA?

Hoooyeah, this stuff can be a blockbuster movie! And it might win an OSCAR!
 

wolfe97

Member
alright, i'll post what i posted in someones journal....
think about this from a legal standpoint. all alkora has the legal right to sell is the FA domain name and thats on;y if he can present documents proving that he paid the domain registration fee, and can prove he's paid the fees to keep that domain name up and running (which i;m pretty sure he hasn;t) then if he CAN present all that he can by a copyright on FA's domain name, and then and only then will he have the legal right to sell the domian name and ONLY the domain name. in this case the law is very much on the side of the current FA administration an dragoneer. in fact because of last nights stunt as well as several things talked about in IM;s between himself and dragoneer, he could go up against charges for extortion, cyber terrorizim, and libel.
 

uncia

Member
wolfe97 said:
and yes, i know i fail at spelling

...and at attempting to calm down the situation, too?
(to say nothing of pushing closer to the end-of-page with an edit post ;))

- "could go up against charges for extortion, cyber terrorizim, and libel"
Erm, what...?

d.
 

wolfe97

Member
extortion (basically, the legal term for black mail I.E his rant to dragoneer "give me 800$ or i sell FA to the highest bidder") libel and the cyber terrorism would be when he jacked FA's domain name off line (a destrustive action with intent of causing fear [the legal definition of terrorism]) and placed up the message about the administration hi-jacking FA from him which is what places libel (written slander)
 

yak

Site Developer
Administrator
Status update will come later.
At this point, FA is stable, and is aimed to stay that way while the debates behind the scenes continue.
They shouldn't have impacted the community in the first place being a very blunt move, but all people make mistakes and personally, i'm more willing to let it slide provided we come to an acceptable consensus out of this.

Interruption of service is not planned for, and as for the future of FurAffinity, there are people here who no matter what will do their utmost to keep it alive. Be assured in that.
The situation is not as bad as it may seem.
 

wolfe97

Member
well, if alkora can really present the documenttation to by a copyright on the domain name and sell it, i could certainly see him wating to pay maybe, MAYBE 50- 100 dollars, which is probably double or triple what the initial registration fee was. but, comone, whne others have paid for the servers and paid fees to keep the domain running, 8000$ is ridiclious for just the .net name
 

Bokracroc

Bokra, come out to pla-ay
At the moment I think the only person qualified to talk about the Law within all this is Gennets because he has a lawyer in his avatar.
Short of that, stop the e-lawyerism. It's a major porn-dump/Furry hub/hole on the internet, not a major news website.
 

uncia

Member
wolfe97 said:
extortion (basically, the legal term for black mail I.E his rant to dragoneer "give me 800$ or i sell FA to the highest bidder") libel and the cyber terrorism would be when he jacked FA's domain name off line (a destrustive action with intent of causing fear [the legal definition of terrorism]) and placed up the message about the administration hi-jacking FA from him which is what places libel (written slander)
Try http://www.whois.net/whois_new.cgi?d=furaffinity&tld=net
Did you check legally to see how could be deemed to be "extorting" if he owns that?
If he had asked for $1,000,000 a case /could/ be made vs. the scope of the site (not /quite/ in the notional "top 10,000" in the world) owing to excessiveness, but with the previous history of domain name sales, his price was probably well within realistic bounds I'd've thought, especially if that also included residual ownership rights on the code as applicable.

As to the other accusations, it would probably be best to lay those aside as it would be easy to counter-claim, I suspect. (And I don't think you'll find your definition of "cyberterrorism" on the statute books, either).

Regards,
David.

p.s. "copyright on the domain name". Erm, please quit whilst you're behind. I can totally understand your concern, but that ain't helping...
 
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