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Religion in the Furry Community

Which Organised Religion Do You Adhere To?


  • Total voters
    175
  • Poll closed .

Fallowfox

Are we moomin, or are we dancer?
I don't get 32:20. Do you mean that they died of drinking powdered gold, or that you think God had killed this calf and then ground it up and made the people drink it?

If I recall correctly...this was part of God's actions taken agains this people while in the desert. They started to doubt God (who had just gotten them free with the help of Moses and Aaron), and thus begun to worship a golden calf that they made...and you know how God gets about idolatry.

Yeah, pretty murderer-y.
 

Nikolinni

Niko Linni
Yeah, pretty murderer-y.

Well see then the thing is God hold you guilty and worthy of death. Which brings us back to the whole issue of sin and all that. The whole thing about the law was that following it would bring you to God, and if you didn't...well you were guilty and worthy of death.

I mean heck, that's what the whole thing about Jesus was about. He died and carried the punishment so you didn't have to...then God brought him back to life as a way of saying "Not only will you get closer to God but you'll get power over death, too!"

So arguably you could say that even the "innocent" people are worthy of death, because as Romans said, "There is no one righteous, no not one".

Disclaimer: I'm not saying I agree with this stuff, I'm just more or less trying to state how things are in the Christian religion. I guess you could say I'm playing the Devil's Advocate? (No pun intended)
 

tisr

I exist perhaps
I don't get 32:20. Do you mean that they died of drinking powdered gold, or that you think God had killed this calf and then ground it up and made the people drink it?

If I recall correctly...this was part of God's actions taken agains this people while in the desert. They started to doubt God (who had just gotten them free with the help of Moses and Aaron), and thus begun to worship a golden calf that they made...and you know how God gets about idolatry.

Basically, Aaron and the Israelites are worshipping a golden calf, so Moses breaks the stone tablets and forces the Israelites to drink powdered gold. Then Aaron tells Moses why the calf was there, and then God says to kill a whole bunch of people and he might forgive them. So they kill 3000 people, and then Moses tries to ask for Aaron and the people's forgiveness, but God says no.
And then God plagues Aaron and the people anyway.

On idolatry: 34:14 (for you shall worship no other god, for the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God)
 
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Fallowfox

Are we moomin, or are we dancer?
Well see then the thing is God hold you guilty and worthy of death. Which brings us back to the whole issue of sin and all that. The whole thing about the law was that following it would bring you to God, and if you didn't...well you were guilty and worthy of death.

I mean heck, that's what the whole thing about Jesus was about. He died and carried the punishment so you didn't have to...then God brought him back to life as a way of saying "Not only will you get closer to God but you'll get power over death, too!"

So arguably you could say that even the "innocent" people are worthy of death, because as Romans said, "There is no one righteous, no not one".

Disclaimer: I'm not saying I agree with this stuff, I'm just more or less trying to state how things are in the Christian religion. I guess you could say I'm playing the Devil's Advocate? (No pun intended)

I don't think humans deserve to be killed just for being humans, and I don't think you can inherit guilt from your ancestors. I would describe those assertions as immoral... wouldn't you?

If there is a God, and he thinks that, he's evil.
 

tisr

I exist perhaps
Well see then the thing is God hold you guilty and worthy of death. Which brings us back to the whole issue of sin and all that. The whole thing about the law was that following it would bring you to God, and if you didn't...well you were guilty and worthy of death.

I mean heck, that's what the whole thing about Jesus was about. He died and carried the punishment so you didn't have to...then God brought him back to life as a way of saying "Not only will you get closer to God but you'll get power over death, too!"

So arguably you could say that even the "innocent" people are worthy of death, because as Romans said, "There is no one righteous, no not one".

Disclaimer: I'm not saying I agree with this stuff, I'm just more or less trying to state how things are in the Christian religion. I guess you could say I'm playing the Devil's Advocate? (No pun intended)

So God creates people who are by definition worthy of death, and then uses that to justify killing them?
+ The whole Jesus thing doesn't make much sense. God sacrificing Jesus(which is also God) and then revives him to save the people(God's creations) from eternal torture(created by God)
 

Nikolinni

Niko Linni
I don't think humans deserve to be killed just for being humans, and I don't think you can inherit guilt from your ancestors. I would describe those assertions as immoral... wouldn't you?

If there is a God, and he thinks that, he's evil.

Which then opens the door for ANOTHER hotly debated subject ,and that's humans and sin. Some think we're born into it and need to be having action taken right away (Hence the whole thing about getting babies and kids baptized); others hold that children are innocent until they become teens, and then it's up to them to take it or leave it; some believe you're good as a teen forward until you sin, and then you need to get forgiveness...

And dear lord. Don't even get started on what it takes to get saved. That's...a whole nother issue right there. Let's just say that saying you believe in Jesus and are sorry for your sins is the LEAST thing that you have to do. Some churches hold that you must ask Jesus for forgiveness, "receive" the holy spirit (some even saying you have to speak in tongues as proof), and get baptized once you reach a certain age. And if you fail on any of those three? tough noogies, see you in hell.

I don't think humans deserve to be killed just for being humans, and I don't think you can inherit guilt from your ancestors. I would describe those assertions as immoral... wouldn't you?


If there is a God, and he thinks that, he's evil.


Which then opens the door for ANOTHER hotly debated subject ,and that's humans and sin. Some think we're born into it and need to be having action taken right away (Hence the whole thing about getting babies and kids baptized); others hold that children are innocent until they become teens, and then it's up to them to take it or leave it; some believe you're good as a teen forward until you sin, and then you need to get forgiveness...


And dear lord. Don't even get started on what it takes to get saved. That's...a whole nother issue right there. Let's just say that saying you believe in Jesus and are sorry for your sins is the LEAST thing that you have to do. Some churches hold that you must ask Jesus for forgiveness, "receive" the holy spirit (some even saying you have to speak in tongues as proof), and get baptized once you reach a certain age. And if you fail on any of those three? tough noogies, see you in hell.


So God creates people who are by definition worthy of death, and then uses that to justify killing them?
+ The whole Jesus thing doesn't make much sense. God sacrificing Jesus(which is also God) and then revives him to save the people(God's creations) from eternal torture(created by God)


Yeah the idea was supposed to be that God had this incarnation of himself, Jesus, and he was the "lamb of God". So what happened was he bore pretty much the brunt of everything in order to make it so humans could be saved. So basically, when you ask Jesus for forgiveness and you accept him into your life, it's pretty much God considering that your sins are now "paid for" by Jesus' blood.


The whole idea of reviving Jesus was basically another way for God to show off his powers. Plus in the OT God had promised his people things like gaining the power over death if they followed him, so resurrecting Jesus was a way of God also saying "Look, this person did what I asked, and look, he now has power over death. I DO keep promises y'all!"


And then there's hell. Ok look, can you guys PLEASE stop bringing in debatable issues :p (The joke being that a lot of stuff I'm bringing up is...hotly debated by churches as to exactly how it works. Hell is no exception). But a lot of churches seem to believe that Hell was made for Lucifer (Aka the devil, aka "Satan" to most people) and his angels when Lucy got a big ego and decided he wanted to usurp God. So God basically said "I ain't havin' that shit!" and cast them out of heaven onto earth. Hell is supposed to be the place where god will destroy them, along with the unrighteous, during judgement times. Which AGAIN, is a whole nother debatable issue.

Also could we get some actual Christians in here to speak on things? I feel like I'm being God's spoke person and I don't even believe in the Christian idea of him .-.
 
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Kitsune Cross

**** that **** now! Bitch
I don't think humans deserve to be killed just for being humans, and I don't think you can inherit guilt from your ancestors. I would describe those assertions as immoral... wouldn't you?

If there is a God, and he thinks that, he's evil.

God alone in the bible killed almost 3.000.000 people, no wonder why people feared him so much, I think the devil killed around 10 people and they were because of some ridiculous bet with god so they share the blame
 

CaptainCool

Lady of the lake
Which then opens the door for ANOTHER hotly debated subject ,and that's humans and sin.

The concept of "sinning" in itself is immoral. The idea that there is this greater cosmic justice that we all just have to accept blindly without any reason is simply disturbing.
It is also immoral because god, if it exists, is directly responsible for our sins:
First of all, we were supposedly created by it. But we were created in a way that makes us impossible to live up to the standards of what is good and evil in the eye of god. Not to mention that this omnipotent and omniscient being knew what we would be doing wrong before we were even born, didn't do anything about it and then judges us anyway. Putting someone into an unwinnable state like that isn't just immoral. It's childish. It's what I did to the Sims when I was 12.
 
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Jarklor

New Member
I'm definitely not Christian because I believe there is nothing wrong with being gay. I'm not atheist because I know in my heart I want to believe in something. Maybe not a god but something. I might want to convert to buddhism. I was even thinking about developing my own religion.


As far as what happens when we die, I really hope I'll reincarnate into a dragon. It's hard to believe there is going to be nothingness. Our souls are separate from our body so it doesn't matter if our skin rots out. Nothing can be created nor destroyed, so our spirits live on. I believe everyone has a soul because each being has their own consciousness. We aren't just "biological machines that walk around."


I guess I'm either agnostic or spiritual. I still have a long ways till I know for sure. There's gotta be something...
 
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Hakar Kerarmor

PRAISE THE EMPEROR

Ayattar

Banned
Banned
God is all about our free will, right? So why did god directly violate the Pharaoh's free will here and made him "harden his heart"?
Almost all christians interprete this passage in a completely different way. That god didn't influence him directly, but that he influenced the circumstances which made the Pharaoh "harden his own heart". But it is right there! Black on white!
Why can a literal clear reading be interpreted in the exact opposite way? If what the passage means is "Pharao hardened his own heart" instead of "the lord hardened Pharao's heart", why didn't it say so in the first place?

It's a matter of writting manner.

Regardless, I higlighted here a part which is interesting me the most. This, the idea od free will combined with the qualities of god, i.e omniscence, knowledge on how it is and how it will be is impossible to fit in the same equation. If the god knows what will be my choices, then I'm living according to some scheme and I lack free will. Having free will would be possible only when god would be able to predict the future with 100% accuracy (possible in case of omniscency), but that wouldn't equal omniscence. Great paradox, as the omnipotency itself (because omnipotency isn't technically possible and even dumb jokes prove that), isn't it? So far none of the christian religions were able to explain it, even considering that it was one of the reasons of eastern schism and later, luteran and calvinist schisms, and many other schisms, religious unrests and splits just to mention monophysitism, arianism, bogomilism etc. Many tried to explain that and it always ended in some kind of a mumbo-jumbo.

I really don't know why are you focusing so much on unimportant details that are dependant on the culture, historical conditions, writting and narration manners and impossibility of proving the existence of the god externally, basing on his traits when there are more important arguments, such as this one, creating internal inconsistency in the idea itself, making it illogical and thus impossible. That means that god doesn't exist, or dogmas of the faith are different/false and people've been fooled, or that his aspects or at least this one, are different/false.

In my case it was this thing that made me doubt in the first place.

And sorry, but as a historian I'm always laughing my ass off when I see those ekhm, 'divagations' entitled "Oh mein gawd, god iz so EVUL he is of kills mani inosentz!" based on the bible, being written without taking into consideration the context and purposes of writing and re-writing this book.
 
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Fallowfox

Are we moomin, or are we dancer?
I'm definitely not Christian because I believe there is nothing wrong with being gay. I'm not atheist because I know in my heart I want to believe in something. Maybe not a god but something. I might want to convert to buddhism. I was even thinking about developing my own religion.


As far as what happens when we die, I really hope I'll reincarnate into a dragon. It's hard to believe there is going to be nothingness. Our souls are separate from our body so it doesn't matter if our skin rots out. Nothing can be created nor destroyed, so our spirits live on. I believe everyone has a soul because each being has their own consciousness. We aren't just "biological machines that walk around."


I guess I'm either agnostic or spiritual. I still have a long ways till I know for sure. There's gotta be something...

Can you be sure souls exist at all? You've defined a soul as the mind, but minds are easily damaged when their brains are injured. They do not simply carry on forever. If they did, why would they need physical bodies to manifest at all?

Was there nothing before you were born?

Having answered these two questions, can a belief in reincarnation be meaningful?

And sorry, but as a historian I'm always laughing my ass off when I see those ekhm, 'divagations' entitled "Oh mein gawd, god iz so EVUL he is of kills mani inosentz!" based on the bible, being written without taking into consideration the context and purposes of writing and re-writing this book.

When people comment that the God represented in the Bible, and indeed many other religious texts, is a character of moral evil this is an important observation.

Lots of people actually think they can improve the way they behave if they act like the deity in their holy text, which is not a good idea when that text is polluted with endorsements of honour killing.

The fact that holy texts, which are meant to be windows into moral truth, have inherited hateful editing is a testament to their uselessness.
If there is a God, no extant holy text is a manifestation of that God, they are merely manifestations of the [often barbarous] ancient cultures which wrote them.

That's an important conclusion.
 
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Ayattar

Banned
Banned
Christian god from the new testament and old testament' god aren't the same god as Jesus changed the concept of father-god to mother-god. I never understood why they're treated as equal by the christians. Old testament should be only an auxiliary tool

If there is a God, no extant holy text is a manifestation of that God, they are merely manifestations of the ancient cultures which wrote them.
Those texts were written by a man, so it's impossible to expect that they won't be influenced by their views and beliefs.
 
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Fallowfox

Are we moomin, or are we dancer?
Christian god from the new testament and old testament' god aren't the same god as Jesus changed the concept of father-god to mother-god. I never understood why they're treated as equal by the christians. Old testament should be only an auxiliary tool


Those texts were written by a man, so it's impossible to expect that they won't be influenced by their views and beliefs.

Agreed and yet a significant fraction of the world treats holy texts as if they are divine and constant. The problem of trying to construct a functional morality on that foundation is more difficult and problematic than simply starting from fresh.
 

Nikolinni

Niko Linni
Can you be sure souls exist at all? You've defined a soul as the mind, but minds are easily damaged when their brains are injured. They do not simply carry on forever. If they did, why would they need physical bodies to manifest at all?

Was there nothing before you were born?

Having answered these two questions, can a belief in reincarnation be meaningful?

I think it just depends on WHY you're reincarnated. For example, in Buddhism you only get reincarnated if you have Karma; that's right, doing immoral things gave you Karma, which kept you trapped in the cycle of reincarnation. By getting rid of all your karma, you would then enter nirvana and exit the cycle once you finished the life you got rid of your karma in.

Another explanation I can think of off the top of my head is in Spectral Shadows; there's reincarnation, and oftentimes parts of a person will survive (Ie their personality, likes, other things), but they're usually unaware that they're a reincarnation, unless they have some sort of of spiritual vision. Reincarnation happens in Spectral Shadows because the universe "doesn't waste anything", so the powers that be view reincarnation as the recycling of souls. Instead of putting it in the after life or destroying it, they just recycle it and there you go.
 

tisr

I exist perhaps
Christian god from the new testament and old testament' god aren't the same god as Jesus changed the concept of father-god to mother-god. I never understood why they're treated as equal by the christians. Old testament should be only an auxiliary tool


Those texts were written by a man, so it's impossible to expect that they won't be influenced by their views and beliefs.

Both the Old and the New testament have a ton of problems.
Since these texts were written by men, you cannot conclude that these primary and secondary sources are fact, sincethe writers could be lying, exaggerating, or misinterpreted the situation.(Why couldn't God have written it himself?)
A variety of sources should be used to confirm the historical accuracy of these events. However, scientific data, archaelogical data, and frequent contradictions in the bible make the bible an incredible data source.
 
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Ayattar

Banned
Banned
A variety of sources should be used to confirm the historical accuracy of these events. However, scientific data, archaelogical data, and frequent contradictions in the bible make the bible an incredible data source.

I was raising this issue several times already. Myself, I was using old testament as an auxiliary source (main source: papyri, clay tablets and shells - both Jews and egyptians were using broken pots for writing) when I was preparing a work regarding status of the Jews in Elephantine in VI and VII century BC.
 
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CaptainCool

Lady of the lake
I'm definitely not Christian because I believe there is nothing wrong with being gay. I'm not atheist because I know in my heart I want to believe in something. Maybe not a god but something. I might want to convert to buddhism. I was even thinking about developing my own religion.


As far as what happens when we die, I really hope I'll reincarnate into a dragon. It's hard to believe there is going to be nothingness. Our souls are separate from our body so it doesn't matter if our skin rots out. Nothing can be created nor destroyed, so our spirits live on. I believe everyone has a soul because each being has their own consciousness. We aren't just "biological machines that walk around."


I guess I'm either agnostic or spiritual. I still have a long ways till I know for sure. There's gotta be something...

Developing your own religion? What is the point of that? That would be pure fantasy, something that you came up with but that has no connection to reality at all.
And just because you "want to believe" in something (which is impossible by the way) that doesn't mean that this "something" is real.

It IS hard to believe. But what reason is there that there should be something after death? There is no evidence AT ALL that souls exist either for example...
As far as we know today we ARE just biological machines. But you know what? That doesn't matter as long as we care for each other.
 

Fallowfox

Are we moomin, or are we dancer?
I think it just depends on WHY you're reincarnated. For example, in Buddhism you only get reincarnated if you have Karma; that's right, doing immoral things gave you Karma, which kept you trapped in the cycle of reincarnation. By getting rid of all your karma, you would then enter nirvana and exit the cycle once you finished the life you got rid of your karma in.

Another explanation I can think of off the top of my head is in Spectral Shadows; there's reincarnation, and oftentimes parts of a person will survive (Ie their personality, likes, other things), but they're usually unaware that they're a reincarnation, unless they have some sort of of spiritual vision. Reincarnation happens in Spectral Shadows because the universe "doesn't waste anything", so the powers that be view reincarnation as the recycling of souls. Instead of putting it in the after life or destroying it, they just recycle it and there you go.

These are human 'feely' explanations. The problem with reincarnation is that there is no physical reason to belief it is plausible, while there is plenty of physical justification to show it is impossible.

It's magic, and magic isn't real.
 

Ayattar

Banned
Banned
Well, considering all the evidence, to believe one must be really strong-willed... or brainwashed. First kind of people I admire and would love to be like them, second... well... You know.
 

CaptainCool

Lady of the lake
Well, considering all the evidence, to believe one must be really strong-willed... or brainwashed.

Brainwashed is right, or maybe also so desperate that you are willing to lie to yourself just to get an answer, even if it is a fake one.
 

Ame

Member
There are no right answers, only perceptions. There is no proof only thought. There is no right or wrong, there is but the Tao

WELL aren't I a special snowflake, my third forum post and its one of the most popular threads :3
 

Jarklor

New Member
Developing your own religion? What is the point of that? That would be pure fantasy, something that you came up with but that has no connection to reality at all.
And just because you "want to believe" in something (which is impossible by the way) that doesn't mean that this "something" is real.

It IS hard to believe. But what reason is there that there should be something after death? There is no evidence AT ALL that souls exist either for example...
As far as we know today we ARE just biological machines. But you know what? That doesn't matter as long as we care for each other.

But how can you know what lies after death? Have you died yet? I'm not claiming these things for sure. It's just something we can never truly know.

As for developing my own religion. I guess I should say just my own belief system. I wouldn't make up any gods or theology.

Can you be sure souls exist at all? You've defined a soul as the mind, but minds are easily damaged when their brains are injured. They do not simply carry on forever. If they did, why would they need physical bodies to manifest at all?

Was there nothing before you were born?

Having answered these two questions, can a belief in reincarnation be meaningful?



When people comment that the God represented in the Bible, and indeed many other religious texts, is a character of moral evil this is an important observation.

Lots of people actually think they can improve the way they behave if they act like the deity in their holy text, which is not a good idea when that text is polluted with endorsements of honour killing.

The fact that holy texts, which are meant to be windows into moral truth, have inherited hateful editing is a testament to their uselessness.
If there is a God, no extant holy text is a manifestation of that God, they are merely manifestations of the [often barbarous] ancient cultures which wrote them.

That's an important conclusion.

Minds carry knowledge and memory which we will loose when we die. But souls carry consciousness and a perception of life that nobody else can see.

Listen to this interesting quote by Einstein: "The religion of the future will be a cosmic religion. It should transcend personal God and avoid dogma and theology. Covering both the natural and the spiritual, it should be based on a religious sense arising from the experience of all things natural and spiritual as a meaningful unity. Buddhism answers this description. If there is any religion that could cope with modern scientific needs it would be Buddhism."

i thought it would be worth mentioning.

There are no right answers, only perceptions. There is no proof only thought. There is no right or wrong, there is but the Tao

WELL aren't I a special snowflake, my third forum post and its one of the most popular threads :3

Good quote. I forgot to say that I'm still far away from the truth and it's only human to try to find that truth. I'll never reach the point "I know everything and only my view point is right" because nothing can be fully proven, nor fully disproven. But many people claim they know everything, ironically.
 
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