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Server Hardware Fault

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yak

Site Developer
Administrator
In the past year, FA ran like a stick of butter 90% of the time for me ( despite its bimonthly crash ). Browsing the site was quick, smooth, and has been quite enjoyable. Sure, your going to have to put a bit of time in the maintenance and upkeep of the site, not to mention tending to life's necessities. All in all, it's still no excuse.

I don't really like saying this as it will look like I'm boasting or something, but... I took a significant part in making sure that it does run well and that you have an enjoyable experience using the website as you did. You seem to be missing that fact.
The task included work in several fields simultaneously, managing and slowly redoing the structure of the database, rewriting the code and server maintenance.
FA's hardware never really was upgraded, and it was used by more and more people with every passing day.

Also, woe is me I guess, I have no excuse for nor working on FA.

what sorta bothers me is the information was stored in a TXT file instead of a dedicated database like mysql lol i mean flatfile databases are cool n' all but not for login information, not only is that incredibly oldschool, and proven to be rather dangerous lol
If you take a look at the dates of the files posted there, you would have much less to be bothered with.
 

nrr

Member
what sorta bothers me is the information was stored in a TXT file instead of a dedicated database like mysql lol i mean flatfile databases are cool n' all but not for login information, not only is that incredibly oldschool, and proven to be rather dangerous lol
Two things.

The credentials were originally stored in a relational database, but this chunk of text you're talking about was generated by doing a quick last-minute dump of the appropriate tables and columns.

You're deluded and completely misled if you think that storing data, let alone login data, sanely (this is the key word) in a flat file database is any more dangerous than storing it in an RDBMS. Clue: UNIX implementations still store user creds in /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow, and the NT SAM database is also a flat file database. In a lot of cases, user preferences for applications (god, especially under OS X) are stored in XML, which can also be considered a flat file database with the appropriate schema in place.

(Disclaimer: I am being a complete and utter wiseass, but that's what you get for being imprecise and totally unspecific about your claims.)

Whaddaya mean, Sun stopped them? They certainly did not!
Read, under the list of procs;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SPARC
Sun's not thrashing their SPARC-powered computers as much as they were in the past.
 

hunterwolf

New Member
:mad:

Seems a lot of furs are irate about FA being down. Lots of blame being thrown around, a lot of "You shoulda done this and that back then and not this."

Look, folks, FA is NOT a right. Its a priviledge!!! Think about it!

What do YOU have to give for access to FA?

Absolutely nothing.

What do the admins have to give for FA?

Time, money, resources.

So give these guys a break!!!! They're dealing with all this angsty emo crap on top of trying to get FA back up and running

1) Best thing to do is sit back, be patient, and wait till these guys get FA back up and running!

2) Or quit whining and throw in some funds to help them out!

If you can do but ONE of those two things, awesome! You're helping out!

If not, you're part of the problem!

Bottom line. FA is free. We pay nothing to access it, to use it. Ths means no one here has the right to go sniping at those trying to bring us back up to speed!
 

xionos

New Member
I don't really like saying this as it will look like I'm boasting or something, but... I took a significant part in making sure that it does run well and that you have an enjoyable experience using the website as you did. You seem to be missing that fact.
The task included work in several fields simultaneously, managing and slowly redoing the structure of the database, rewriting the code and server maintenance.
FA's hardware never really was upgraded, and it was used by more and more people with every passing day.

Also, woe is me I guess, I have no excuse for nor working on FA.

Without trying to spark an argument, why not put out a solid code first, then fix the bugs rather than rewriting as you go? What your doing is the same thing as releasing a piece of software in a beta stage, then step it up to the finished product when it's already commercially available. It just doesn't work like that. Your going to end up stressing over too many things at once to make it truly worth while...which from what I've gathered, is already the case.
 

Firehazard

I can fix it!
http://clanspum.net/~pi/fa/ said:
Also, an edit as of 2007-03-10: FA and administration have failed to provide a compelling reason why the source code (.fpd files) are not under the GNU General Public License. I therefore refuse to remove the code, as said license permits me the right of redistribution.
Urm... wait. Am I reading this right? You have the right to redistribute the code under the open-source license, on the grounds that the code is not open source? In what freaky alternate universe does that make sense?

As far as donations go: I think there ought to be one of those thermometer thingies on the site that shows what hardware we'd like to buy, how much it costs, and how close we are to meeting that cost. Then people would get an idea of what's going on money-wise and have some idea where the money goes, not to mention an incentive to push the site's funds along a little more.
 
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Arcturus

Banned
Banned
The old FA codebase never used flat file DBs for -anything-
 

xionos

New Member
:mad:

Seems a lot of furs are irate about FA being down. Lots of blame being thrown around, a lot of "You shoulda done this and that back then and not this."

Look, folks, FA is NOT a right. Its a priviledge!!! Think about it!

What do YOU have to give for access to FA?

Absolutely nothing.

Same thing as access to Deviant Art, Furr Art Pile, Hentai Foundry, and VCL, but they don't go down as frequently and actually have near fully functional code.

What do the admins have to give for FA?

Time, money, resources.

That they get from donors

So give these guys a break!!!! They're dealing with all this angsty emo crap on top of trying to get FA back up and running

1) Best thing to do is sit back, be patient, and wait till these guys get FA back up and running!

2) Or quit whining and throw in some funds to help them out!

3) Or make the point that they should have something more solid before allowing a massive community to swarm in and cause more stress on the server than what it can handle. Crap like this will cause the site to crash, then they will pour in hours and throw donor's money at the problem to fix it, then the users will get some upload and viewing time just to have the process repeat its self

If you can do but ONE of those two things, awesome! You're helping out!

If not, you're part of the problem!

Bottom line. FA is free. We pay nothing to access it, to use it. Ths means no one here has the right to go sniping at those trying to bring us back up to speed!

Irates come with the job, I'm sure they can handle it. The site being free won't change this. If the mods really really wanted to get things up to speed, then they would have locked this thread already and started knuckling down to resolve the problem and get the site back up rahter than spending time in the forums.
 
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Arshes Nei

Masticates in Public
This is like... a really bad high school debate.
 

starlite528

Member
Urm... wait. Am I reading this right? You have the right to redistribute the code under the open-source license, on the grounds that the code is not open source? In what freaky alternate universe does that make sense?

As far as donations go: I think there ought to be one of those thermometer thingies on the site that shows what hardware we'd like to buy, how much it costs, and how close we are to meeting that cost. Then people would get an idea of what's going on money-wise and have some idea where the money goes, not to mention an incentive to push the site's funds along a little more.

That's what I'm thinking!
First, the word "DOUCHEBAG" comes to mind. Posting old code.
Second, the GPL only permits redistribution if it was originally under that license. You can not simply declare private code as open source just because you feel like it, especially since it's not yours. If that's your site, it would behoove you to take that down; you're opening yourself up to a lawsuit.
 

Pi

Member
Without trying to spark an argument, why not put out a solid code first, then fix the bugs rather than rewriting as you go? What your doing is the same thing as releasing a piece of software in a beta stage, then step it up to the finished product when it's already commercially available. It just doesn't work like that. Your going to end up stressing over too many things at once to make it truly worth while...which from what I've gathered, is already the case.

Because then you get whiny furries saying that your software will never come out.
 

Pi

Member
Urm... wait. Am I reading this right? You have the right to redistribute the code under the open-source license, on the grounds that the code is not open source?

No, I have the right to distribute the source because at one point they kept claiming that it isn't GPL, yet have failed to provide proof otherwise. It's got copy/pasted chunks from GPL code, and it's also got GPL headers in some of the files.
 

Gutierrez

Draconic Laconic
As far as donations go: I think there ought to be one of those thermometer thingies on the site that shows what hardware we'd like to buy, how much it costs, and how close we are to meeting that cost. Then people would get an idea of what's going on money-wise and have some idea where the money goes, not to mention an incentive to push the site's funds along a little more.

I think that's a great idea. It gives more visibility to what the site needs and where the money is going. It also offers at least a sense of responsibility on the admins side to use it where they're saying they will. Besides, I'd love to see the art concepts that people could come up with to visualize how funding is coming along.
 

Eevee

Banned
Banned
Second, the GPL only permits redistribution if it was originally under that license. You can not simply declare private code as open source just because you feel like it, especially since it's not yours. If that's your site, it would behoove you to take that down; you're opening yourself up to a lawsuit.
Supposedly FA's code was originally based on an old old project of Alkora's that was GPL. Since it was a derivative and was not relicensed until after the leak, Pi has a decent argument that his copy is GPL.

Because then you get whiny furries saying that your software will never come out.
:(.
 

YuchiDaYena

Teh Mobster Yena
:mad:

Seems a lot of furs are irate about FA being down. Lots of blame being thrown around, a lot of "You shoulda done this and that back then and not this."

Look, folks, FA is NOT a right. Its a priviledge!!! Think about it!

What do YOU have to give for access to FA?

Absolutely nothing.

What do the admins have to give for FA?

Time, money, resources.

So give these guys a break!!!! They're dealing with all this angsty emo crap on top of trying to get FA back up and running

1) Best thing to do is sit back, be patient, and wait till these guys get FA back up and running!

2) Or quit whining and throw in some funds to help them out!

If you can do but ONE of those two things, awesome! You're helping out!

If not, you're part of the problem!

Bottom line. FA is free. We pay nothing to access it, to use it. Ths means no one here has the right to go sniping at those trying to bring us back up to speed!

Amen :3
 

starlite528

Member
No, I have the right to distribute the source because at one point they kept claiming that it isn't GPL, yet have failed to provide proof otherwise. It's got copy/pasted chunks from GPL code, and it's also got GPL headers in some of the files.

Not having a license attached doesn't mean you can put one of your own on, period.

Just because a file or two might have a GPL header does not automatically cover the rest.
 

Pi

Member
Not having a license attached doesn't mean you can put one of your own on, period.

Just because a file or two might have a GPL header does not automatically cover the rest.

When the files are clearly derivative works (which is something that FA in general apparently has a problem understanding), you are wrong.
 

Pinkuh

Member
Irates come with the job, I'm sure they can handle it. The site being free won't change this. If the mods really really wanted to get things up to speed, then they would have locked this thread already and started knuckling down to resolve the problem and get the site back up rahter than spending time in the forums.

Actually we are totally SOL until we get the hardware to fix things. Hardware that we are currently in the process of getting money for... that hasn't been ordered yet. So I suggest that you get off your high horse and look at this situation with some logic.

We are spending time in the forums and reading this thread because despite what users may think at this point we care GREATLY for this website. I don't know of any better group of people that put up with the daily BS we get for free. We watch, build, and make this site out of love for the community, and nothing else. We don't get paid, we have lives, jobs, yet every day we are on here trying to make this place better for all the users as a whole.

Do you think we LIKE being down? Do you think for some reason that we get our jolly's off by making the user base suffer? All of the admins/coders on this website are more nervous and more angry at this happening then the users could ever fathom. This is our baby, we want to raise it right, But much like a real child there are developmental hitches that we all have to deal with, and this happens to be one of them.

Deal with it or leave.
 

YuchiDaYena

Teh Mobster Yena
While I do say it'd be nice to have this and that.

I also need to say guys, lighten up a little, the admins are not tryign to be elitists, they're trying to do the best they can, I'd say try to appreciate the fact that they are doing this for you. They don't HAVE to do this, you know?
But they brought you a place just for you, and just because it goes down alot doesn't mean it's the admins fault.

Have you ever stopped to think that the FA staff is spending time that they dont' have to, and money that they could be using for their own personal use to bring you something?
I'm not trying to start drama, just sharing my own opinion. :)
 

Arcturus

Banned
Banned
Not having a license attached doesn't mean you can put one of your own on, period.

Just because a file or two might have a GPL header does not automatically cover the rest.

Good portions of the code were taken from GPL licenced software.

As per GPL rules, that means the entire code is under the GPL. (To the best of my knowledge.)

Plus, the parts of which I wrote, I treated as being under the GPL like the rest of it.

So..

HOWEVER:

Pi should take down the database dumps. Those are -not- distributable, like the code is.
 
Tired of people being dicks? Try new BANHAMMER(tm)!

Seriously, if I was admin and I had people giving me shit like this, they'd be gone. There's no excuse for giving the admins grief over what is essentially a free service.
 
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